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Where Have All The Doblers Gone?

By Joanna Robinson | Posted Under Miscellaneous | Comments (62)



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We talk a lot about Lloyd Dobler around here. And we’re not the only ones. There’s an entire generation who love him and put him on a pedestal as The Ideal. Then, of course, there are those who revile Lloyd Dobler, who believing he’s ruined romance for the rest of us. (*cough* Chuck Klosterman *cough*) But what is it about Lloyd Dobler? Fiction is littered with better looking, smarter, more romantic fools. Why Lloyd Dobler? It’s been talked about. It’s been bounced around. I know many think Dobler plays into this Dominant Woman fantasy of a subservient, docile pretty boy who will take our abuses and still claim the only thing they want, their only ambition is to love us. Cause, you know, they’re good at it. That’s the worst kind of gender role flip, trading one domineering partner for another. But I’d really like to think better of the Dobler Devotees (me included).

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And you know what I think? I think it’s because of her. I think it’s because no matter how smart Diane Court is suposed to be. No matter how pretty I think Ione Skye’s hair is. She doesn’t deserve him. And that’s not me being flip. She gave him a pen. SHE IGNORED HIS BOOMBOX SERENADE. So there it is. It’s not just that Lloyd Dobler is great. And he is. It’s that those of us watching are convinced he could do better. That we would do right by him. In fact, that we would do right by any young man who would defiantly jut his chin for us. For love. For Peter Gabriel. And maybe I feel so protective of him because I’m older now than the fictional young Lloyd. He certainly gives off a vulnerable air, all pale and somewhat consumptive looking. But even in the film his friends (the female ones anyway) mother him. And that’s not the sort of thing I usually respond to, to be honest. Usually, I’m more of a fan of the meeting of true minds. The sort of verbal sparring that populates the screwball comedies of yore. I like relationships where men and women are truly equal. But I have to admit, there’s something potent about the Dobler Effect. Something insanely compelling about trampled, tender young hearts.

Take Preston Myers (Can’t Hardly Wait) who traded Peter Gabriel for Barry Manilow. Who lavished puppy-eyed love and affection on a perfectly nice, if large haired and totally undeserving Amanda Beckett. Is this what our Preston deserves?
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And poor Hal Hefner (Rocket Science) who laid himself bare over and over…
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and misguided young Tom (500 Days Of Summer). You can do better, young Tom. She’s beautiful, but she’s not for you.
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And little Scott Pi-NO. Wait. Not so fast, *sshole. You two deserve each other. No, I mean it.
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Because oddly enough, and ideals (and Preston Myers) aside, those relationships are pretty recognizable. Summer’s not an *sshole, Tom’s not an idiot. They’re just trying their damndest. And young Hal Hefner? Well who hasn’t been trod on by some girl who looks like Anna Kendrick? And, most of all, Scott Pilgrim and Ramona Flowers. In the most unrealistic genre of all, Edgar Wright’s heightened video game reality, you’ll find the most realistic relationship. Two damaged people, young and careless, fighting tooth and nail to hold on to each other. Screw the boombox, that’s pretty romantic. You know, if you think about it.

Joanna Robinson thinks kids these days have it easy with their fancy e-lectronics. Boomboxes are heavy, you know.









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Comments

I don't want any of these dorks. Give me someone with a backbone, not some sniveling kid. Why is this "romantic"? Where is the attraction?

Posted by: peanutbutterjellytime at August 11, 2011 4:05 PM

Tell me Chuck's wrong.

Posted by: Jay at August 11, 2011 4:05 PM

Hmm...gonna have to watch Scott P. again, cause I didn't get any of that out of it. How many times do you people have to watch these movies to come up with such deep-set opinions about the characters and situations? Maybe I'm just doing it wrong...

Posted by: NateS1973 at August 11, 2011 4:07 PM

You don't get, Nate, how Scott Pilgrim is one giant throbbing METAPHOR under all the whizbangpop?

Posted by: Heather at August 11, 2011 4:09 PM

Nate, I'm pretty judgemental. most of the time, once the opening credits have run, my opinion of the characters are set in rapidly hardening concrete. By 20 minutes in I've removed the forms and brushed off the concrete. At that point I'm already writing angry/loving screeds on my favorite movie site. Well, composing them in my head. I don't use a cell phone or computer in the theater because I'm not that guy.

Posted by: Mrcreosote at August 11, 2011 4:11 PM

Still have never seen "Say Anything."

*runs*

Posted by: Intern Rusty at August 11, 2011 4:15 PM

Don't forget Laurie(Christian Bale) professing his love to Joe(Wynona Ryder) in Little Women. Worst rejection ever.

Peanutbutterjellytime is keeping it real. Do people still say "keeping it real"? Anyway.

There are plenty of dudes like this walking around, but nobody wants them. Girls want to be told what to do not asked. Is it a shock that every asshole I see has a girl? No.
Girls just say they want romance because they have to. They are not going to go around saying "you know, I really want a guy to not listen to me, yell at me, and basically treat me like an old dish rag." Even though that's what ends up happening and it's totally cool. Because they ain't dating a guy that worships them and does nice things for them. Nope. An asshole just has to something remotely nice every once in a blue moon. "He yelled at me the other day and I thought he was going to hit me. But he took me to dinner and he wore a tie. He was so cute."

Posted by: junierizzle at August 11, 2011 4:18 PM

J-Ro, how do you you get the craziest comments out of people I will never know.

(It's an art. I'd teach you. But I'd have to charge.--JR)

Posted by: Nimue at August 11, 2011 4:23 PM

junierizzle, I beg of you, get more friends. The ones you seem to have are broken.

Posted by: Heather at August 11, 2011 4:25 PM

This just made my whole day.

Posted by: grace b at August 11, 2011 4:26 PM

"Don't forget Laurie(Christian Bale) professing his love to Joe(Wynona Ryder) in Little Women. Worst rejection ever."

OH MY GOD YES.

Posted by: grace b at August 11, 2011 4:27 PM

The best Cusack is NOT "Say Anything" it's the movie preceding it, "The Sure thing". That's a relationship movie, Cusack is not nearly as pitiful and he's her mental equal, if a bit immature.

Plus, the best part of the movie is how, at the VERY VERY VERY end, he kinda dodges the question about 'did you sleep with her'?

"The Sure Thing" is the better Cusack.

Posted by: Pragmatist at August 11, 2011 4:28 PM

There are plenty of dudes like this walking around, but nobody wants them.

Like a bunch? Like a whole crew? Like a Doblergang, er, that sounds pretty fucking sweet.

Posted by: Tribecky at August 11, 2011 4:34 PM

I mean, why would Amanda Beckett pay any attention to a unique spirit like Preston, or even a unique spirit like me? Maybe it's because she's a little busy ordering around her little conformist flock of sheep. SHEEP! You are ALL sheep.
...baah!

Sorry, I like a dude with cojones and the ability to recognize that hotness does not always indicate worthiness.

Posted by: Jessie at August 11, 2011 4:39 PM

Pragmatist, no. It's cool to like the lesser known film, I know, but Say Anything is definitely the better Cusack.

"I don't want to sell anything, buy anything, or process anything as a career. I don't want to sell anything bought or processed, or buy anything sold or processed, or process anything sold, bought, or processed, or repair anything sold, bought, or processed. You know, as a career, I don't want to do that. "

Posted by: John G. at August 11, 2011 4:42 PM

I agree, Pragmatist- I saw The Sure Thing first and although I did find room in my little teen heart to love Lloyd Dobler, he seemed like a wan cousin to Walter Gibson...somewhat "reeePRESSED!!"

Posted by: Scratch McGee at August 11, 2011 4:44 PM

I like a dude with cojones too, and Lloyd totally has them.

He called her up.

Why?

Because he's Lloyd Dobler.

Posted by: Mel C. at August 11, 2011 4:47 PM

Ok, we we are going to have a Cusack quote-off, let's start with this one from "The Sure Thing":

Gib: [talks to Alison while she swims] I flunk English, I'm outta here. Kiss college goodbye. I don't know what I'll do. Dad will be pissed off. Mom will be heartbroken. If I play my cards right, I get maybe a six-month grace period and then I gotta get a job, and you know what that means.
[Alison ignores him]
Gib: That's right, they start me at the drive-up window and I gradually work my way up from shakes to burgers, and then one day my lucky break comes: the french fry guy dies and they offer me the job! But the day I'm supposed to start, some men come by in a black Lincoln Continental and tell me I can make a quick 300 just for driving a van back from Mexico! When I get out of jail I'm 36 years old. Living in a flop house. No job. No home. No upward mobility. Very few teeth. And then one day they find me, face down, talking to the gutter, clutching a bottle of paint thinner. And *why*? Because *you* wouldn't help me in English, no! You were too busy to help me! Too busy to help a drowning man!
[he falls into the pool]

Posted by: Pragmatist at August 11, 2011 4:47 PM

or:

Walter (Gib) Gibson: Elliot? You're gonna name the kid Elliot? No, you can't name the kid Elliot. Elliot is a fat kid with glasses who eats paste. You're not gonna name the kid Elliot. You gotta give him a real name. Give him a name. Like Nick.
Alison Bradbury: Nick?
Walter (Gib) Gibson: Yeah, Nick. Nick's a real name. Nick's your buddy. Nick's the kind of guy you can trust, the kind of guy you can drink a beer with, the kind of guy who doesn't mind if you puke in his car, Nick!

Posted by: Pragmatist at August 11, 2011 4:48 PM

What with different people liking different things, I would like to throw in my vote for Gib Gibson.

Posted by: Mrs. Julien at August 11, 2011 4:55 PM

P.S. All of the above is bullshit. I'm floundering in a sea of confusion and total despair, but, knock on wood, I still have my health.

Posted by: Mrs. Julien at August 11, 2011 4:55 PM

Sensitive as he may be, I still think Lloyd has a backbone and knows what he wants. Cory did give him some sound advice though.

Cory: Why do you have to be like this?
Lloyd: Because I'm a guy! I have pride.
Cory: No, the world is full of guys. Be a man.

Posted by: elizabeth at August 11, 2011 5:02 PM

Look at all the antique iPods!

I haven't seen "Say Anything" either.

Posted by: BWeaves at August 11, 2011 5:03 PM

What Mel C. said.

Posted by: MM at August 11, 2011 5:16 PM

If you say Lloyd had cojones, I would have to take your word for it. I was mainly going of off Joanna's and other commenters' characterizations of him (which was admittedly pretty lazy), as I am among those who have never seen "Say Anything".
As a wee teen lass, I was sort of immune to the boy-craziness my peers were experiencing, and as a result never watched most of romantic-type films that girls love in their early teens. Now I feel I'm probably too old to relate to the story, especially when I hear that Diane chick was so not worth all that trouble--I friggin hate when that happens in films/TV.

Posted by: Jessie at August 11, 2011 5:21 PM

The best quote from Say Anything isn't Lloyd's. It's, "Don't be a guy. The world is full of guys. Be a man."

And The Sure Thing beats Say Anything, if only because it taught my college crowd how to shotgun beer.

Posted by: Wednesday at August 11, 2011 5:23 PM

I have to disagree with what the author says about Summer in the end of the article. She WAS a complete asshole, and frankly I don't see what the Gordon Levitt character saw in her.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at August 11, 2011 5:25 PM

Gross Pointe Blank is clearly the best Cusack.

Posted by: fracas at August 11, 2011 5:29 PM

Gross Pointe Blank is clearly the best Cusack.

Clearly. Followed by "Better Off Dead" in a close 2nd.

Posted by: Jessie at August 11, 2011 5:33 PM

Yeah, this type of dude never, ever set my heart racing. Lloyd Dobler? I hated Say Anything. Preston? Stop your fucking whining, be a man and do something about it. Tom? He's an idiot and I hated that movie, and Summer was right all along. Scott Pilgrim? Good lord, why do you always sound like you're falling asleep?

I never wanted a Lloyd Dobler. A stalker who harasses you with loud music and gets obsessed with you? No, thank you. I couldn't tell you exactly what I wanted, but I know what I've never wanted. One of those.

Posted by: figgy at August 11, 2011 5:45 PM

quityourJRob is my new favourite twitter handle.

Posted by: Brenton at August 11, 2011 6:14 PM

I have to agree with BSlim. I don't know what Tom sees in Summer. Not because she's an asshole (she's not, she's careless), but because she doesn't like him very much or treat him all that well. I dunno about you, but when someone doesn't like me very much, I don't tend to like them back.

Posted by: Joanna Robinson at August 11, 2011 6:20 PM

Thank you, figgy. I have never, never understood the Lloyd Dobler thing. He's creepy and annoying and you know that in five years he'll be sitting on her couch in his underwear yelling that NO he CAN'T turn down the tv, the game is on and can't she write her stupid dissertation somewhere else.

Posted by: Artemis at August 11, 2011 6:55 PM

I've always seen "(500) Days of Summer" as a story about the danger of falling in love with the idea of someone rather than the person in front of you. Tom was so convinced that Summer was his dream girl, was everything he wanted in life based on a few small and insignificant things like the fact that she listened to the Smiths and was very pretty, that he was blinded to the woman in front of him who took ever opportunity to tell him exactly who she was and what she wanted.

He thought he was in the middle of a great love story, and Summer thought she was having a fling with some guy who was kind of cute. The tragic thing was that neither of them were wrong, but both were far too inside their own heads to see what what happening.

Also I'm with figgy. From what I've heard of the movie Lloyd comes off more stalkery and like he can't take a hint than anything else.

Posted by: Intern Rusty at August 11, 2011 7:02 PM

Martin Blank was always my favorite, but I completely relate to Rob Gordon. I'm not sure what that says about me.

Posted by: =DocDoom1= at August 11, 2011 7:12 PM

The Sure Thing is a fun movie, but it does not have the grounded resonance of Say Anything. Not by a long shot. And I wouldn't put these others you mentioned in the same realism category either. Scott Pilgrim Vs. The World is also very fun, but I didn't for a second see any of the chemistry or rapport onscreen between Scott and Ramona that I would need for it to be in the same ballpark as Say Anything.

I disagree that Diane is not worthy of Lloyd. Diane recognizes Lloyd's greatness. It's why she falls for him. The conflict of Say Anything stems from the bad timing of their coming together at a very difficult juncture in her life. To say that she ignored the boombox is not fair. She didn't ignore it. She just needed a little time to work through her issues.

Posted by: DarthCorleone at August 11, 2011 7:52 PM

Intern Rusty >> Please see the movie before passing judgment on Power Lloyd.

Posted by: DarthCorleone at August 11, 2011 7:53 PM

What DarthCorleone said.

Posted by: elizabeth at August 11, 2011 8:17 PM

she's an asshole (she's not, she's careless), but because she doesn't like him very much or treat him all that well.
Posted by: Joanna Robinson at August 11, 2011 6:20 PM

And that's why, she was an asshole. She was an asshole... to him.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at August 11, 2011 8:20 PM

Darth, while you may have grounds for the argument of greatness of the movie itself (I might have to disagree- resonance or not, Say Anything just never struck the same on the smitten scale as The Sure Thing), on character alone I favor Gibson for his verve....even in my most swoony stages of watching Say Anything, I still had a little niggle in the back of my mind, wondering how wonderful it would REALLY be to have a guy solely want to be in love with me...the responsibility for someone's happiness like that? At that age? If that was a female, oooooh my I can imagine the character assassinations!

Posted by: Scratch McGee at August 11, 2011 8:32 PM

Oh and The Sure Thing is the superior film.

Why is this even a discussion?

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at August 11, 2011 8:34 PM

Date the assholes, marry the Dobblers.

Posted by: jp at August 11, 2011 8:42 PM

A few months ago I went to a wedding and the woman walked down the aisle to "In Your Eyes", which was coming from a boox box held over the groom's head.

The sound cut out (as we were setting up it was patchy, so we knew this MAY happen), so the groom AND ALL OF THE GUESTS JUST STARTED SINGING.

It was the most amazing thing I've ever seen. And now my own wedding is ruined. Ruined!

Posted by: Internet Magpie at August 11, 2011 9:45 PM

I like your analysis of (500) Days of Summer, Rusty. Now watch Say Anything before the regulars fire up the Murdertank and hunt you down like a rabid dog.

Posted by: Uriah Creep at August 11, 2011 10:57 PM

I can't be the only one who thinks Lloyd Dobler is kind of a creeper who would have gotten my fist if he showed up outside my house and annoyed my neighbors, right?

And coupled with the rest of these dickbags? This is a whole mess of DO NOT WANT for me.

I don't get it. I'm not judging, I just don't get it.

Posted by: Maggie at August 11, 2011 11:07 PM

Read up, Maggie, you're definitely not the only one.

Posted by: figgy at August 11, 2011 11:11 PM

Rusty, that's probably the best interpretation of (500) Days that I've heard, and perfectly describes why I love that movie. Well, that and JGL. Obviously.

Posted by: Even Stevens at August 12, 2011 3:22 AM

That first quote from the Sure Thing is hillarious Pragmatist, is the rest of the film as funny?

Posted by: Ender at August 12, 2011 7:07 AM

Lloyd was *not* stalker-y! He knew Diane loved him but broke up with him from sheer cowardice and an inability to stand up to her horrible father. After trying a few times (answering machine messages & boombox-holding) he was sad but moving on. It was Miss Diane who came crawling back to Lloyd Dobler when she realized she was a total asshole & didn't deserve him, but was about to walk away from someone amazing.

Dammit.

Posted by: monasterling at August 12, 2011 10:33 AM

Ender. Yes, "The Sure Thing" is Cusack snappy patter at its best. In looking for quotes, I found some interesting trivia as well. Cusack was actually only 16 when the movie started filming. Rob Reiner didn't want to hire him because he was a minor, so his family emancipated him.

It also has a hilarious Tim Robbins as an uptight whitebread driver who likes to sing showtunes.

And the scene in the Bar is pretty classic.

Old guy at bar: "I was in Paris once with my wife...boy am I glad she's dead".

or

Friend: I hear she only likes the intellectual types.
Gib: I'm intellectual and stuff.
Friend: your failing English, its your mother tongue, and stuff. (full quote)

Posted by: Pragmatist at August 12, 2011 10:52 AM

ACK! The quote I copy pasted up there has the "your" incorrect.

it's a "You're failing English". Know I must go and castigate the moviequotes.com site for allowing that to happen.

Remember people, just because it's on the internet doesn't mean it's spelled correctly!

Posted by: Pragmatist at August 12, 2011 10:59 AM

Preston thinks Amanda is his soulmate because she has big tits, pretty hair, and they both like strawberry Poptarts. They've never had a freaking conversation! How does he know anything about her? He's just like every other dude that drools over her, only he wears ironic t-shirts so we're supposed to identify with him. Nope.

Posted by: Estelle at August 12, 2011 11:02 AM

Being old and male I have no dog in this fight but how anyone could think a guy named Lloyd Dobler could EVER be cool is beyond me.

Posted by: logan at August 12, 2011 12:01 PM

I would have gone with "'n'stuff" Pragmatist.

I can't even tell you how many times my brother and I phoned each other and announced, "I'm talkin' to you cordless!".

Posted by: Mrs. Julien at August 12, 2011 12:45 PM

Pragmatist, I promise I'm not trying to be shitty but, NOW you must go...not judging...

Posted by: E the B at August 12, 2011 1:05 PM

Yes, that "Know" typo was just Karma biting me on the callipygian.

Somehow the "your/you're" thing bothers me at some primal level; I suspect that for many people "your/you're" isn't a typo, folks just have no freaking clue which is the right one.

Posted by: Pragmatist at August 12, 2011 11:32 PM

If Cameron Crowe's ex picked up the message, it shouldn't be so hard for us to toss away his primer-toned anodyne crap. I'm going to blood eagle the next fool who calls Kate Hudson's work in Almost Famous was luminous. Sleeping with rockers and doing drugs--that's not method acting, it's 1985 onward. I guess that's more phosphoresent than luminous, I don't know, I fell asleep. And Say Anything, fie. The one time when he's holding electricity has to be the time when it doesn't rain. What an undercooked loser that Dobler is, even for a teenager.

Posted by: Jo 'Mama' Besser at August 13, 2011 3:12 AM

SO MUCH WORD Estelle. I love that movie for other reasons, but that plotline is just...stupid.

THEY NEVER EVEN TALKED TO EACH OTHER!!! So, he writes some creepy a88 letter about how he's loved her for four years based on a pop tart, and then she just falls for him???

I'll tell you who did this-the classic cold hearted popular b8tch latching on to some poor guy just because the popular guy just broke up with her-better: John Hughes. Some Kind of Wonderful. At least Eric Stoltz was also hot.

Posted by: anon33 at August 13, 2011 11:49 AM

There are people in this world don't like Lloyd Dobler.

I don't want to live on this planet anymore.

Posted by: Anna at August 14, 2011 5:08 AM

The first chapter in Sex, Drugs, and Cocoa Puffs changed my life. I first read it when I was in a relationship and though, "oh that poor Chuck. He'll never know what love is with that attitude." And then I read it again a few months after a breakup and it made me feel so much better about being single.

But I think he's married now, right? Cuuuuuute.

Posted by: exploranora at August 14, 2011 12:00 PM

Superb Keira...what more can I say..Not a lot of people can have so many different dress. Nevertheless, she is an extremely wooden actress, and if she didn't have that beautiful face, she would never be cast in movies!

Posted by: creer portefolio at September 3, 2011 11:28 AM

I just bought a pokemon Card Set for my son i hope he likes it.

Posted by: Paul Despain at September 9, 2011 8:49 PM