Pajiba

Here is my attempt at a summary of what is really going on in Mulholland Drive for those of you who have only seen it a few times (I'm sorry it's so ungodly long):

Basically, the whole movie is a dream that Diane Selwyn (Naomi Watts) has shortly before killing herself. Everything that comes before the Club Silencio/opening of the blue box/"hey pretty girl, time to wake up" part is her dream. Everything that comes after is the "real world" although most of it takes place in flashbacks. In the flashbacks we finally learn who Naomi Watts character really is (a struggling actress getting chewed up by Hollywood, recently left by her lesbian lover who is now dating a big director) and what she's done (hired someone to kill her former lover). These events and the resulting guilt take their psychological toll on Diane. They inspire her dream and then lead her to suicide.

It only adds to the confusion that Lynch decides to fuck with us in dream world and rotate names and identities. For example: The Naomi Watts character is named Diane. When she is at Winkies hiring a hit man she is served by a waitress named Betty. Then in her dream she adopts the name Betty when she reinvents herself as a fresh-faced and naturally talented ingenue. At one point in the dream she is at that diner where the waitress now has her name, Diane, which looks familiar(obviously) and therefore gets absorbed into the amnesia investigation as they search for the identity of Rita. This search eventually leads them to Diane Selwyn's apartment where they find the dead body that foreshadows Diane's eventual suicide (lying in the same position that sleeping Diane is in when she wakes up). But you don't have access to any of this information until the end of the movie and by then you are so confused and frustrated that you don't even want to try to understand what is going on.

It actually makes a lot more sense to watch the last half hour first, which is what I finally did last week. The last half hour is mostly flash back to the events leading up to her dream and suicide.

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Here is a synopsis of the events that actually happen in the "real-world": (feel free to skip this part)

Diane wakes up looking like hell with her neighbor pounding on the door wanting her stuff back [also, notice there is a blue key on the coffee table in this scene, this is a sign that the hit man has completed the job she hired him for: that her ex-girlfriend is already dead] She is very emotional, and appears to hallucinate her (dead) ex-girlfriend Camilla Rhodes (Laura Harring). Then she starts flashing back to some topless lesbian play on the couch, when Camilla started to break up with her. "It's him, isn't it." Diane says, and then we flash back further to Diane and Camilla on the set of some 50's movie. Justin Theroux is the director and apparently the "him" in Camilla's life. Camilla is the star of the film and Diane is on the sidelines with a smaller part.

The flashback continues to Camilla inviting Diane to some sort of party at the director's house on Mulholland Drive. She arrives in a car, "we aren't supposed to stop here" but it is just some back way to the house where we see a lot of other familiar faces (familiar because this party occurred in the past and the people at the party were incorporated into her dream). At the party Diane tells us a little bit more about herself: She came to LA from Deep River, Ontario after winning a dance contest and inheriting some money from her aunt. She met Camilla on the set of a movie called "the Sylvia North Story". Daine wanted the lead but it went to Camilla. They became friends (and, we presume, lovers) and Camilla, the more successful actress, continued to help Diane get parts in some of her other films. We can assume that this is all the true back story of these characters in the real-world.

Diane grows more agitated as the party progresses. A strange woman comes over and kisses Camilla. The director guy and Camilla start to make an announcement (are they engaged?) but can't stop laughing. Note: Since this part of the movie is a flashback that Diane is having from her apartment (after she wakes from the dream, before she kills herself) we can question the reliability of her memories (were they really laughing uncontrollably and shooting her weird looks or is this just the way that Diane remembers the betrayal and humiliation of being invited to their party?)

And then, still in flashback, we jump to a Winkie's Diner where Diane is talking to a hit man. She is going to use the money she inherited from her aunt to have Camilla killed. She shows him a picture: "this is the girl." The hit man tells her that once she pays him, it is done. He shows her a blue key which is going to be used to signify to her when the job is done (which we saw on her coffee table before this extended flashback). Then things get a little surreal as Diane's deteriorating psychological state starts to intrude on the flashback. There is the demon/homeless person behind the diner and the crazy miniature old people who come after her- this seems to be somehow a manifestation of her guilt over having Camilla murdered- and then the flashback ends and we return to real-world, real-time Diane in her apartment at the breaking point.

The mini old people come in under her door and grow to full size but there is still knocking at the door (maybe the police, the two officers who were looking for her?) Diane is being chased around the room, tormented by her demons and her guilt (are these manifestations of her parents? Her aunt? Just some couple she met at the airport that represent her break from innocence on her arrival in LA?) and she runs screaming into her bedroom, pulls a gun out of the end table and shoots herself in the head. There are a few superimposed images of Diane and Camilla together, ghostly remnants of her dream as the last few synapses fire before fade out. The whole film (real-world, real-time) takes place entirely in the apartment. First she has the dream, then she wakes and has the flashbacks, then she commits suicide.

/ boring Summary
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The structure of the movie is difficult of follow but it does make sense. The primary story being told in the film is the dream-story, not the actual one (like the Wizard of Oz). We get the dream first, which is disorienting because it follows a kind of dream-logic that never gives you a firm hold on what is going on. It is filled with vague illusions, symbols, and references to real-world events (that haven't been revealed to us yet) and introduces a lot of mysteries that don't get resolved (these are dream mysteries, dead ends that don't have any resolution).

After waking from the dream we get the flashbacks to the "real-word" events that lead to the dream. This provides us with a context to understand the dream and Diane's fragile mental state (it's also a hell of a performance by Naomi Watts, who wasn't even nominated for an Academy Award, but Bridget Jones was, and Halle Berry won). Once we know the real-world story we see how the dream is Diane's idealized and stylized fantasy of Hollywood, the movies, herself, and her lover... And all the while the darker side of things, the jealousy, the guilt over what she's done, the power and corruption that control the industry and the evil that lurks around corners or within herself continually intrudes on that dream world and eventually tears it apart.

Watching it again (and again and again) we see how artifacts from the real-world and flashback scenes at the end of the film keep turning up in bizarre places in the dream world (stack of money the purse, blue key, black & white head shot, espresso). And how people from the real world were repurposed for the dream. Aside from the idealized version of herself there is the director who gets emasculated, thrown out of his house, loses control of his movie, and basically has his life torn apart until he is put in his place. Camilla/Rita is now dependent on her for help and support, and part of a sexual fantasy as well. The hit man she hired is a bumbling idiot (the assignment to kill Camilla/Rita obviously failing) and goes through the darkly comic scene in the office building. Even small characters who appear in the background at the party get incorporated into her dream as powerful and shady figures. Coco, the director's mother, becomes the landlady at her apartment. The Castigliane brother with the espresso can be seen at the party, and a strange man in cowboy clothes passes out of the room at one point. It is reminiscent of the ending of The Wizard of Oz ("And you and you and you...and you were there.") where it is revealed that the main events of the film were a dream populated by familiar people and events in different roles.

Even bits of dialogue from her real-world memories were turning up in the dream most notably "this is the girl" which we learn was something actually said by Diane as she paid to have Camilla killed and gets repeated in the dream by the powerful and unnerving men in suits who seem to be controlling events from behind the scenes. It was actually Diane that set these events in motion (that's her phone by the red lampshade and the ashtray that rings at one point).

But I've gone on long enough and still barely covered the surface-level understanding. What does all of it mean? There are so many great scenes, so much symbolism and complex layers to unravel...

(Also, where do I pick up the award for longest comment in Pajiba history?)

Brace yourself, folks; work is slow and I have a lot to say…

That first paragraph sums up my experience—I found myself frustrated, confused, but interested enough to do some online research and figure out what the hell I just saw. I can appreciate a movie that makes me think, even if I barely slept that night because my brain kept churning away, trying to make sense of something that might be, in the end, nonsensical.

OK, so this was supposed to be a potential series, right? Because otherwise a few scenes just seemed to come out of absolutely nowhere and have nearly no relevance to anything. The Winkie’s scene, for instance. Who were those guys? What did they have to do with anything? And the scene with the bungling hit man. I laughed, I thought it was hilarious at how much he sucked, but then it just made me wonder if he could have even carried out a hit on Camilla if he was that inept. If this was supposed to be a series I could see why you’d need to setup some characters and why it wouldn’t necessarily gel with the rest of the film.

I liked it. I usually like most of Lynch’s stuff, and it was nice for a change that there weren’t any super-gross images (like the lancing of Baron Harkonnen’s boils in Dune. Eww!). I also like how his films don’t seem set in any particular era. I got a lot of 50s vibes coming off this one (like with Wild at Heart), just from the clothing and set design and the way Plucky Betty behaved. I don’t recall seeing a single computer throughout the film, but there were cell phones. I didn’t find it confusing, just interesting.

I loved Adam’s character, simply because he seemed to represent the audience. Weird shit is going down, and he doesn’t get it, but he goes along with it anyway like he expects to eventually wake up out of this wacko bullshit nightmare. The pink paint on his coat and the way he causally carried a golf club around were nice touches.

Because I’m used to Lynchian weirdness, I managed not to yell “WTF?” until the Club Silencio scene (I yelled something equally rude at the appearance of Billy Ray Cyrus—seriously, the hell?). I had read about this movie before and the general consensus seems to be that the disillusioned Betty we see near the end is the real one, and the bulk of the movie is something she dreamed up before dying. So her beloved Camilla escapes the hit Betty put out on her and becomes a vulnerable amnesiac who needs Betty’s help, and they develop a loving relationship instead of a destructive one. But there were plenty of people who felt the movie wasn’t meant to be interpreted but just watched. Since my mind is the kind that can’t leave well enough alone but demands ANSWERS and LOGIC, I tried to figure out all the roles people were playing within this dream.

I took Wheelchair dude to be the part of Betty’s brain that was directing everything to her satisfaction, the various thugs to be acting out Betty’s revenge fantasies on the guy who stole her lover, and the old couple—well, shit, I don’t know who those white-haired freaks were supposed to be. Creepy as hell, that’s for sure. Maybe her conscience? They seemed gleeful in the cab, like they knew how it was going to end and boy wouldn’t it be fun to see Betty get what she deserves? Random old guys in big empty rooms are typical Lynch, so I don’t even try to make sense of them. ToastFace Homeless Guy—well, he wound up with the box, and the old people came out of the box, and so….

Yeah, I got nothing. Still liked it though.

"once you get the lesbian love scene out of your system — allow you to take it from there."

Nope, not gonna happen

re: the little old people

Some theorize that Diane's grandparents (who she lived with back in Ontario) were abusive to her (the reason why the opening sequence of her winning the dance contest shows them blurred out - there is something bad about them that she is trying to block out) and that their return at the end signifies one more threatening memory from her past that triggers her suicide.

Others point to the common Lynchian of the unexplainable, the red herring, the dead end. Lynch will purposefully insert things into his movie that *seem* to have some symbolic value but that in fact refer to nothing or to nonsense. It is a game that he plays in order to make the point that not everything in life makes perfect sense, not everything is an allegory, not everything has an explanation. According to this theory, (1) the first theory is playing an interpretation that is invalid. It represents an attempt to place order onto a chaotic world. and (2) Diane's suicide is *partially* triggered by all of these traumas and jealous rages that she recently encountered. But not entirely. Just as the "dream" was not an accurate and truthful recounting of Diane's life, neither are these "memories." We don't have access to her inner life and so we can never *really* understand everything about her and about her decision to end her life.

That said, I have another contribution to the interpretation game. That neighbor who comes over to demand her stuff, the kinda frumpy brunette? Some (me included) think that *she* is actually the ex-lover that Diane wanted dead. Camilla is simply that woman looked at through the eyes of a lover. Diane sees her as beautiful, talented, perfect in every way, the center of a life that is worthless is Camilla is not in it. But in the "real" world, we see a more "objective" view of that same woman. (Similar to the operation that makes "Betty" a better dressed, sunnier, more talented actress than Diane is in real life). Thus, the "neighbor" is demanding her stuff because she is moving out and dumping Diane.

Dustin's question #6 is the one I am most interested in. What is Lynch really trying to say about Hollywood with this movie. I can't bring myself to take a totally cynical view of his portrayal. In some ways this film feels like a love letter to classic movies, old Hollywood, great actressin'. At the same time he insists on rubbing your face in the vileness and corruption just beneath the surface, like the opening of blue velvet where roses and picket fences give way to teaming insect life underground.

Does Lynch claim to care about how Hollywood destroys it's leading ladies? This is the guy who has been accused frequently of outright misogyny in portrayal of women (Blue Velvet, Wild at Heart, Lost Highway).

Does he have nothing but contempt for the movie industry, or is there a bit of sympathy for Adam Kesher (Justin Theroux) being strong-armed by mysterious men in suits who seize control of his film (and while this is, in some ways, still critical of Hollywood it is also a championing of the auteur like Lynch).

Well, Yossarian basically said everything, so what is left to say?

I don't know that it's a dream though so much as events coursing through Diane's (Naomi Watts) head.

1) First, what are your general impressions of Mulholland Dr.?

I adore it. I think the actresses are fantastic, and I'm a huge fan of Lynch's style.

2) Mulholland Dr. was originally conceived as a television series...

I think many things were created so the audience would have a lot to mull over (in trying to put it all together) if the movie had been a series.

3) Back in college, creative writing instructors often suggest that you should never end a story with either a suicide or a dream...

Again, I don't think it was a dream, per se. I have no issues with the way the film ended, as everything came together for me - it all made sense.

4) The diner scene with the nightmare monster. What the hell?

Just Diane's version (in her head) of the homeless dude.

5) I’m still not entirely sure what Lynch was trying to do, say, or accomplish with the cowboy. Anyone care to take a stab at the cowboy’s significance to the story?

I think the cowboy is possibly Diane's agent.

6) There are a lot of layers, it seems, to peel back to see what’s underneath. One of the major themes, however, is Lynch’s view of the emptiness of Hollywood, and how the gloss and beauty of it (Betty) obscures the ugliness beneath (Diane). Did you get that? Would you care to expand?

I think for many people, the idea of Hollywood is a dream/fantasy. I think Lynch was just exploring that. I didn't get anything about us as consumers though.

7) How would you place Mulholland Dr. among other Lynch films?

It might be my favorite - or right behind Blue Velvet.

8) The blue key and the blue box — I understand their use in the movie (the key signifies the death of Rita, and inside the blue box, so to speak, is the alternative reality flashback — the idealized version of Diane’s life and her relationship with Rita). But why a blue key and a blue box? Is there any significance attached to that?

I don't know if I believe that Rita was really killed. I don't know that Diane ever knew Rita as more than a friend - that any more of the relationship existed. I think it was fantasy. I think the key was the key to Diane's happiness/dreams, and really, the box was empty.

9) Billy Ray Cyrus? Really?

Yeah, that was bad.

10) Finally, what is Lynch trying to say with that extended lesbian scene?

Fantasy!

I thought the scene with Billy Ray was actually hilarious. Just imagine someone of his mental capacity working with a complete freak like David Lynch. "Duh...what?"

Side note: I saw Lynch "speak" at the Brattle Theater in Cambridge, MA for Inland Empire. He read some random poem and brought out a girl who played the violin terribly, and on purpose I would imagine. Sadly, that was the most normal experience of the night - Inland Empire = fucking crazy.

I love this movie (one of the few videos I willfully returned late, as I kept watching it over and over).

Question that's always bugged me...in the DVD "hints" that Lynch provided, he asks "can you hear the name of the movie that Adam Kesher is auditioning actresses for?"

The answer is of course that it's the movie that the "real life" Diane is starring in.

But I couldn't hear anyone actually say the movie's name out loud at any point other than the end, where it's obvious (well, more obvious) what's going on.

What did I miss? Or is this a Lynchian red herring.

Jacktrade, i don't remember them specifically, but i think those 'hints' were a joke.

jacktrade>> I snagged this from another website. I was waiting for discussion here to pick up, and ended up searching the internet for Mulholland Drive theories...

Can you hear the title of the film that Adam Kesher is auditioning actresses for? Is it mentioned again?

Another hint that we deal with alternate realities.

1. We hear on the set that Adam Kesher is auditioning for the leading role in the "Sylvia North Story" (stagehand announcing: "The Sylvia North Story, Camilla Rhodes, take one." just about when Blond Camilla walks in).

2. This movie title is mentioned again by Diane at Adam's dinner party. Wilkins tells that Bob Brooker directed the "Sylvia North Story" and Camilla was great in it.

Judging from the title, "The Sylvia North Story" is presumably a tragic story of a fallen starlet, for which both Diane and Camilla were auditioning. Irony to their tragic ends.

Yossarian summed it up exactly how I see it - the movie is Diane's hallucination/dream followed by flashbacks of her life.

To answer a few of the questions:
1. This is the third time I've viewed the movie, and I was bored. The first viewing made me go "WTF?"; the second time some of the pieces fell into place and I could make some (just some) sense of it; but the third viewing seemed to drag on and on and ON. And sometimes I think Lynch is just weird for the sake of being that weird guy who makes movies. It's hard to criticize someone if they're intentionally weird - it's like he's saying, "Your words mean nothing to me because I am BEYOND that! Look how strange and bizarre I am!" And then he tap dances while a midget plays a kazoo. How can you argue with someone like that?

2. Probably doesn't matter, but I think they were meant to be fleshed out in the tv series. But I have nothing to really base that on.

3. I think he had to do something, because it was no longer going to be a tv series, but I think it works for the movie to end with Diane's death.

4. I know!

5. Does he represent some part of Diane's subconscious, moving things along? I don't know.

9. I KNOW!

10. Who doesn't like boobies?
I mean, to be less vulgar, I think it was showing how Diane desired Camilla, plus you could throw in the idea that she desired to BE Camilla as well. It just all came together in one steamy love scene.

Re the Cowboy, I've always seen him as a plot movement device, in the same vein as his Lynchian predecessor, the Mystery Man in Lost Highway ("No, I'm at your house right now...go ahead and call me.").

It's questionable if people in the movie in the movie even perceive this character. Cowboy interacts really only with Kesher, right? And in Lost Highway, Mystery Man interacts with Bill Pullman and I think Robert Loggia's characters only.

I'll never forget when we saw this in the theater. As it was ending and the credits came up, we hear this man's voice loudly say "That WAS Billy Ray Cyrus!" As if he was wondering that to himself during that part in the movie and it was going to drive him nuts all night if he didn't find out. The excitement and relief in his voice made me chuckle.

As for his role in the film, I thought it was awesomely random and provided an odd sort of comic relief to the audience to give our hard-working brains a break while still feeding the 'WTF' parts of our brain just to mess with us.

Part of me wonders if Diane was maybe a BRC fan or at least familiar enough with him that Billy Ray Cyrus just showed up in her dream as the pool man. Like in dreams where people you know are there but not themselves and he really WAS Billy Ray Cyrus, just not the country singer as people know him. Its Diane's crazy subconscious and in this dream, he is the face of the pool man that Adam's wife cheats on him with. and THATS why he's in this movie throwing everyone off with his out-of-nowhere-ness.

I don't know. Maybe I'm reaching too far and reading too much into it. In fact, I KNOW I am but I thought it was a fun cameo and a funny thought.

OK, now I'll try and answer the questions.

1) General impressions -- I really liked it, it's completely insane but even if you don't understand what's going on you can still identify with the characters. You understand their motivations, even if the larger picture is fuzzy.

2) "Nonsense" sequences in Mulholland Dr. -- I think it doesn't matter, all these scenes add to the general sense of creepiness and confusion, which seems to be another theme of the movie (we don't always know why things are the way they are or why we do the things we do). I bet some of them would have been explained in the TV show, but not all.

3) Suicide/dream to end the movie -- I think the suicide was a deliberate decision. The ending, to me, actually is the part of the movie that makes the most sense. Not quite sure what you are talking about with the dream, are you talking about the old couple, which I see as symbolizing cultural norms - attacking her for being a loose-moraled murdering lesbian - or the images and visit to Silencio after the gunshot? I'm not sure I think of that as a dream. Of course, I may not be remembering the ending exactly right - I've only see the movie twice.

4) The diner scene with the nightmare monster. What the hell? -- The only thing I can come up with is that the diner is where Diane supposedly hires the contract killer, so the monster's presence there may represent general evil/ deviation from social norms (again represented by the old couple, who escape the monster and get revenge on Diane)

5) Cowboy - well, the cowboy usually represents America. If we have learned anything in the last decade or so, it's that America is always right. So the cowboy could represent America/ mainstream Hollywood, the "right" way of doing things. If a maverick director wants to do his own thing, he will be punished. Of course, the cowboy is only trying to help the director by telling him what to do, and if the director doesn't follow instructions the cowboy will have to take action.

6) Lynch’s view of the emptiness of Hollywood, and how the gloss and beauty of it (Betty) obscures the ugliness beneath (Diane). -- I actually think pre-amnesia Rita is the embodiment of Hollywood, gorgeous and sophisticated on the surface but underneath just a whore who will do anything for money.

7) How would you place Mulholland Dr. among other Lynch films? -- I haven't seen all of Lynch's films, but it's now my favorite, mostly because I feel I understand it the most thanks to this discussion. Twin Peaks Season 1, however, is better.

8) But why a blue key and a blue box? Is there any significance attached to that? -- Well, with my stalker theory in mind, the box could represent Diane's box, which is blue because Camilla doesn't know she exists and therefore won't have sex with her. (Not really, I have nothing to contribute here.)

9) Billy Ray Cyrus? Really? -- I know, that took me right out of the movie.

10) Finally, what is Lynch trying to say with that extended lesbian scene? -- Which scene are you talking about - the one in the dream or the one in the flashback? I guess my answer is good for both. I didn't think either scene was that long or different from a mainstream sex scene except for the gender of the two participants. If it had been a het sex scene, would you still think it was long or out of place or had deeper meaning? Maybe it's just a scene to represent the feelings the two characters have for each other (or the feelings Diane imagines are there).

A couple people have already mentioned that you don't need to worry about knowing what everything means to enjoy this movie. It doesn't need to be a puzzle to solve, it can just be about the emotional response to what is on the screen at any given moment: the powerhouse acting, the dark and unexpected humor, clever irony, or the Badalamenti score and Peter Deming cinematography.

The reason Mulholland Drive is my favorite David Lynch movie is because it has by far the best 'enjoyable scenes to incomprehensible bullshit' ratio. This is a crucial metric for evaluating Lynch. Lost Highway, for example, had a whole lot of incomprehensible bullshit. It also had the creepy-cool Robert Blake scene, the unsettlingly detached Bill Pullman, the scene where Robert Loggia flips out and beats the shit out of a guy for tailgating, etc. Blue Velvet had a lot of random and unpleasant stuff but the opening sequence with the ear is pretty impressive, and Dennis Hopper's ranting and raving (though that is slightly unpleasant, too), and Roy Orbison. For Inland Empire the ratio probably goes negative, way too much bullshit.

I can't argue with the fact that there is some frustrating incomprehensible self-indulgent bullshit in this film. But if you can't sit back and love the hell out of some of the scenes and the performances in this movie, well, I don't know what to say.

- The bumbling hit man in the office building, especially when he drags the fat women out of the office (could it get any worse?) and we see the janitor in the background (it can!) and then his expression when the smoke alarm goes off (priceless!)

- Pretty much everything that Justin Theroux was in. I would trade the lesbian sex scenes for five more minutes with JT. The glasses, the weird affectation of carrying a golf club to a studio meeting, the response to his wife's affair, the meeting with the cowboy

- The cowboy

But also the little things. Tons of little things. The detectives surveying the accident scene ("could be someone's missin"). The big burley mob guy who is looking for Adam Kesher and ends up punching Billy Ray Cyrus and the look on his face after he tenses his fist to knock the psycho woman off his back. That little hesitation when Rita is reading lines with Betty before awkwardly delivering the line "then they'll put you in jail"

Anybody else get that? What were some of your favorite scenes or favorite moments? What stood out? What makes you want to turn to the person next to you and describe it in depth until they feel what you feel?

My little theory.
Bear with me.

They are in hell.
Their actions through the movie are what get them there and the movie itself is their gradual awful realization of this.

The old folks are the demons who bring them there. The monster and the cowboy are various embodiments of that realization. (ie: 'what you want is now irrelevant')

It's not just one person's hell. It is all hell.

This is not a religious thing for me. I'm not getting all religiousy here.
But there were some 'clues' that led me to think this and it makes the movie make sense for me.

There is one scene that takes place on a street. In the frame is a telephone pole. On that pole is a poster that in fact says 'In Hell'.

Every realization anyone has is a terrifying one. The monster, to me is the 'true' face of the man who tells the story of him. It is himself he sees, without the rose colored glasses of self deception.

Same with the two women. The Silencio scene was another 'clue'for me - nothing here is real. Not just the club, but the whole 'world'. You will never get satisfaction only the endless loop of your life and the stripping away of your illusions.

That is why Diane is so 'ingenue' when she arrives. That is how she sees/saw herself, when she was really quite the opposite. As for the suicide, I saw the scene where they find the dead body as her seeing her own self having killed herself and her realizing where she in fact is.

That's why the old folks come for her at the end. Why they have been there all along. .

I don't see any of this as a stretch.
And forgive me this take on it.

It's not because she is a lesbian. It is about the cruel choices she, and all the rest there have made.

To me, self realization can be the most terrifying thing. When you see you have been an asshole. And that to me is what this movie is, and why it scares the hell out of me (joke unintended) and why I love it so much.

As for BRC, I didn't know who he was so it didn't affect me at all beyond making me laugh.

The blue box? I don't know. Recycling, maybe?

Thanks for letting me drop my two cents in.
Like I said, this take on it is the one that makes the most sense to me.

Damn, I got caught up in a deadline and couldn't make it for the discussion proper. I'm going to watch it tomorrow armed with these new insights, and maybe, MAYBE, I'll finally feel as though I've experienced the film, not just observed it. Now, if only someone could explain Infinite Jest, what the point of expensive umbrellas is, and why men think staring at your tits for the entirety of a 1/2 hour bus ride is an acceptable thing that you won't even notice, then I'd have all the answers in the world.