web
counter
 

"Doctor Who" — "Let’s Kill Hitler": The Doctor Invokes Godwin’s Law

By C. Robert Dimitri | Posted Under TV Reviews | Comments (64)



doctor-who-lets-kill-hitler-3-570x320.jpg

“You named your daughter…after your daughter.”

Yes, Steven Moffat truly followed through on that brazen episode title. Like Tarantino’s Basterds, Spielberg’s Jones boys, and the (thankfully) little-seen British sitcom Heil, Honey, I’m Home, The Doctor finally had his chance to mock Earth’s most famous homicidal dictator and most oft-cited source of hyberbole in analogies. Rather, it was Rory’s right hook that most directly tweaked Hitler, but we’ll come to that. Did Godwin’s Law hold true in this case? Does Doctor Who automatically lose by daring to make a space-time continuum stop in 1938 Berlin?

Since our mid-season cliffhanger that yielded the revelation of River Song’s parentage, Amy and Rory have been waiting to hear from The Doctor, who took off on his own to track down their kidnapped daughter. You would think the TARDIS would enable The Doctor to pop back in instantaneously rather than leaving Mom and Dad to fret over a fruitless search lasting a few months, but the old sexy TARDIS takes The Doctor where and when he needs to be as always. This time that’s in a personalized crop circle made by Rory and Amy to summon The Doctor, and crashing the rendezvous is Amy’s wacky, gun-toting, sports-car-stealing childhood best friend Mels.

That sounds like an extreme entrance, right? If you happen to recall the introduction of Poochie The Dog in The Simpsons and equate it with that, you would not be too far off. This intro is particularly jarring when accompanied by a series of flashbacks that inform us of Mels’ lifelong history with Rory and Amy. Not only has she had a front row seat for their relationship from the very beginning when little Amelia was oblivious to young Rory’s unrequited crush, but she had an obsession with Amelia’s imaginary friend The Doctor and longed to meet him. This seems like a rather important character, doesn’t it? Why haven’t we heard about her before? There’s something not quite right about this, and why did Mels’ entrance remind me of an entrance that River Song might make?

To escape the cops hot on Mels’ tail, she demands that they take the TARDIS for a spin to eliminate Hitler, and The Doctor complies at gunpoint because Mels is in Yosemite Sam mode and shoots a hole in the TARDIS console. Their crash landing into Hitler’s office just happens to prevent a shape-shifting robot controlled by miniaturized members of a time-traveling justice corps from assassinating Hitler themselves. (Yes, I can scarcely believe that I typed that sentence either.)

Do not worry, though. These ministers of justice avoid the butterfly effect by only punishing criminals immediately before the end of the established lifespan. Thus, they mistakenly were a little early for Hitler. Now that I have assuaged your fears about Hitler’s well-being and the normal path of human history, we can continue.

There is a moment of awkwardness as The Doctor, Amy, and Rory realize a grateful Adolf Hitler stands before them, but that moment ends when Hitler shoots the recovered robot to defend himself and also hits Mels. Rory decks Hitler and stuffs him in a cupboard. The robot is immobilized and seemingly unharmed; Mels is the more immediate concern. As her life force slips away, she cheekily reveals her identity, regenerating into the one and only River Song, except she is not “River Song” quite yet, and Melody Pond dismisses the name.

Alex Kingston chews the scenery, as she has fun reveling in her new form that Time Lady regeneration has brought. Rory and Amy shift into the recognizable demeanor of uncomfortable parents. The discomfort increases, as once the fun is out of the way, River embraces the task at hand that Madame Kovarian and The Silence set for her via brainwash conditioning years before: murdering The Doctor.

The Doctor and Melody engage in a flirtatious battle of wits centered around her attempting to shoot him, but he is a step ahead of each move she makes, leaving her with unloaded guns and a banana loaded with little more than potassium. A quick kiss is his undoing; River Song’s younger homicidal self uses fatally poisonous lipstick as opposed to her later preference for the hallucinogenic variety.

Barely able to walk, The Doctor retreats to the TARDIS, where the computer interface settles on the form of young Amelia Pond to let The Doctor know he has 32 minutes to live. (Prior to Amelia, The Doctor rejected his own form out of self-loathing and the forms of Rose, Martha, and Donna due to the guilt they induced.) The Doctor lacks the physical strength to continue, but a mention of “fish fingers and custard” inspires him to carry on.

Amy and Rory have tailed Melody, who is flouting the powers afforded to her during regeneration by killing Nazis and demanding that a ballroom of people ditch their clothes and evacuate so that she can find a new outfit. Tailing Amy and Rory, however, is the aforementioned justice robot known as the Tessalecta. The Tessalecta miniaturizes Amy and Rory and transports them within itself, where they meet the crew. It assumes Amy’s form and freezes Melody with a ray and the intent to punish her for the murder of The Doctor. Melody is hazy about the memory of the crime. (Having not reached the bridge of the ship yet, Amy and Rory remain unknowing of this particular crime as it appeared to be committed by their daughter in the season opener.)

Holding on to his last few minutes of life before the poison overcomes him, The Doctor intervenes, chastises the operators of the Tessalecta for their god complex, and encourages Amy to stop them from hurting her daughter. Amy uses The Doctor’s sonic screwdriver to turn the ship’s robotic antibodies against the crew. The crew escapes via teleportation up to their mother ship, leaving Amy and Rory as the only potential victims of the ship’s security. The Doctor is no longer able to stand, and he pleads with Melody not to leave and to instead save her parents. Crawling toward the TARDIS, we see an unmoving robotic Amy Pond over one shoulder of The Doctor and a conflicted Melody Pond over the other.

Overcoming her psychopathic programming and using her kinship with the TARDIS, Melody pilots it into the Tessalecta, saving Amy and Rory from the antibody robots at the last possible moment. Back outside, The Doctor succumbs and with his dying words asks Melody to take a message to River Song. Melody asks Amy who River Song is, and Amy uses her privileges as a relative to the judged to ask the Tessalecta to take the form of River Song. Melody is moved by the sight of her future self and uses the remainder of her regeneration energy - and what we learn is also all of her remaining regenerations - to bring The Doctor back to life.

The Doctor, Amy, and Rory drop Melody off at the Sisters of the Infinite Schism, the best hospital in the universe. The Doctor leaves behind the blue diary that we later see her use in tracking their meetings across time and space. Amy and Rory are emotionally torn by the situation; they never had the opportunity to raise River as their own child, even as they spent so much of their youth with her. The Doctor tells them that they have too much foreknowledge to do anything except leave her alone at this point, even as he furtively glances at data that he downloaded from the Tessalecta: the foreknowledge of the time and place of his own death.

***********

If a paradoxical Moebius strip of time travel is what you wanted, “Let’s Kill Hitler” delivers.

To review: Amy and Rory conceive a child on the TARDIS. That child Melody is kidnapped and conditioned to murder The Doctor. That murder takes place in Utah in 2011 (or so it would appear), as the still pregnant Amy and Rory watch, along with the adult version of the same child. Afterward, Melody escapes from her captors, regenerates, and finds her way to Scotland to be best friends with her own parents. Once Melody reaches young adulthood, she meets The Doctor for the first time with a clear, conscious awareness of her own actions and tries to kill him again in 1938. After dodging punishment there for the murder that will take place in 2011, she studies to become an archaeologist in the distant future so that she can plant various summons for The Doctor to find her, joins The Doctor on several adventures, and serves jail time for the crime of murdering him. The two of them might marry at some point, and the entire basis for each one’s past is his or her interaction with the other in the future.

I do not recommend attempting to conceptualize the logical cause and effect of all those events.

Evil River Song is fun. She is so much fun that at the end of the episode I was disappointed that this seems to be all that we will see of her. I think she had the potential to be a great recurring villain before her inevitable redemption. Alternatively, I thought an incarnation of River prior to the Alex Kingston edition could one day be a regular companion for The Doctor, but that possibility also seems to have been precluded.

I do have a few questions about Melody and her motivations: why did she decide to grow up with her parents after her first regeneration? Was her intent to guarantee her own existence by bringing Amy and Rory together? Knowing that her mother would travel with The Doctor in the future, was her goal to meet The Doctor and kill him? If this is the case, is she compelled to kill The Doctor across all points in the space-time continuum over and over? Is it simple bloodlust that drives her to attempt to kill him in 1938 Berlin when she knows the assassination will later (later from his perspective, that is) be successful? She expresses awareness if not a clear memory of killing The Doctor in 2011 (in her past). Perhaps this knowledge aids in overcoming the conditioning and allying with The Doctor and her parents.

Friends of mine that enjoy Doctor Who have issues with the increasing passivity of Amy within the framework of the story. That is, she and Rory are still actively involved, but - AT&T-sponsored motion comic of a motorcycle chase notwithstanding - there is not much that makes them uniquely necessary, and Amy seems emotionally detached at certain times. I recognize their point to some extent, although I think part of the problem owes to attempting to cram many things in a relatively short period of time. There were still a few beats within the story that kept me emotionally invested in their journey. Tying Melody back into their history and catapulting them into the role of parents to a hellion that they already know well worked for me, even if it was rushed.

As for Godwin’s Law, Moffat denied the rule and prevailed in my opinion. Keeping Hitler’s presence to a cameo and not dwelling on the well-covered time-travel story lore of the dangers of altering history was a wise decision. Granted, this might be the most serialization-dependent adventure in Doctor Who history; a new viewer would be very lost jumping into the program at this point.

Matt Smith’s performance carried the day once again in my opinion. He displays chemistry with Melody/River, he falls and crawls over the place as the poison takes effect, and he delivers the usual rapid dialogue, which in this episode included building on his list of “rules” for his companions that travel in the TARDIS.

There might be another surprise or two down the road, but it seems like Moffat has given us the complete basic framework of the story of River Song. Are you satisfied? Disappointed? Are we absolutely certain that was young Melody shooting The Doctor in the spacesuit? How is Moffat going to write his way out of this “fixed point” of The Doctor’s death? If Amy and Rory end companion duty with this season, will that be on good terms?

Please discuss in the comment section, but never knowingly be serious and remember that time is not the boss of you.

C. Robert Dimitri would use a time machine simply to learn answers to the big mysteries of history rather than attempt to dispense justice. As Abe Simpson advised Homer Simpson on his wedding day: “If you ever travel back in time, don’t step on anything, because even the tiniest change can alter the future in ways you can’t imagine.”










Each Time You Like, Share, Tweet or Stumble a Pajiba Post, An Angel Does the Paul Rudd Dance



Life in a Day Review: Reducing Life to Its Banal Essence One Video Camera at a Time | The Postmortal by Drew Magary: Eternal Youth Will Mess You Up









Comments

Is it simple bloodlust that drives her to attempt to kill him in 1938 Berlin when she knows the assassination will later (later from his perspective, that is) be successful? She expresses awareness if not a clear memory of killing The Doctor in 2011 (in her past). Perhaps this knowledge aids in overcoming the conditioning and allying with The Doctor and her parents.

Wait, when does she express awareness of killing the Doctor in 2011, which is her past/his future? I missed that, and it's been confusing me.

Posted by: Cimorene at August 29, 2011 3:13 PM

The Mel thing bothered me. We were told when Amy was introduced that she was a solitary lonely child and that's why she latched on to The Doctor like a clam: because he was her only friend, so where did this bosom friend come into it? We didn't see her at Amy and Rory's wedding that I can remember? Why wouldn't her best friend be at her wedding?

Posted by: PaddyDog at August 29, 2011 3:16 PM

Good summing up of an incredibly confusing plot.

I really don't like River Song. I wish the childhood friend Melody could have stuck around a little longer, I thought she was fun.

Posted by: snapnhiss at August 29, 2011 3:21 PM

She expresses awareness if not a clear memory of killing The Doctor in 2011 (in her past).

When? I was curious that you seem certain she is killing him again, here. Are you making the assumption based on the astronaut suit in the opener? Or did she say something that I missed?

I don't think we've seen the total arch of her story at all. They purposefully left open a door there, with Rory asking if the brainwashy bits were gone and having the Doctor avoid answering. I think we're meant to assume there will be further issues, especially with River-in-the-eyepatch from the season trailer.

The beginning of this episode took me out a bit, and I wasn't sure how I felt about it. It didn't take long before I was loving every second. I can't wait to involve my new little Whovian-on-the-way in all of this...

Posted by: Patty O'Green at August 29, 2011 3:24 PM

As it turns out, Mike Godwin (he of That Law) is a big Doctor Who fan, and got a kick out of the fact that they traveled to Nazi Germany to kill Hitler:

http://twitter.com/#!/sfmnemonic/status/107641025706729472

Posted by: jeem at August 29, 2011 3:25 PM

@Paddydog - Mels said that she 'didn't do weddings' - A weak explanation, but they did at least try to make one.

Posted by: Itmustbebunnies at August 29, 2011 3:29 PM

@PaddyDog Time can be rewritten.

Posted by: Kahntahmp at August 29, 2011 3:31 PM

I had a realization while driving after the episode. Did they just leave Hitler in the closet? I'm pretty sure he's still there at the end of the episode.

I don't remember her saying anything specifically about it either, but she has to know that she's already killed the Doctor in her past right? I too was trying to figure out why she was still trying to kill him even though she's already been successful. Maybe it's part of her psychopathic/brainwashed upbringing?

I love that Rory is going the full Mickey. He's making the turn from simpering wimp to kind of bad ass. Rory is awesome.

Posted by: Socrates_Johnson at August 29, 2011 3:31 PM

I don't think they established when they met (remet?) Mels. It could be that they didn't meet until after Amy met the Doctor as a child, which would make some sense. Here's someone who actually believes you that your "imaginary" friend is real. Still doesn't explain her absence at the wedding though.

Posted by: Socrates_Johnson at August 29, 2011 3:35 PM

Posted by: Patty O'Green at August 29, 2011 3:57 PM

My brain is hurting just thinking about any of this. It didn't seem to me that River had any knowledge of already killing the doctor. I do think that she's the one in the spacesuit but maybe it's adult river and not little River? I mean the spacesuit in 2011 doesn't have to have the same person in it as 1969.
Also I think she sought out Amy and Rory in Leadworth merely to be with her parents. I think most of the time she's fine and then when the doctor appears, it's like a switch flips and her brainwashing comes into play. That's how it seems to me anyway, but the truth is I'm not sure of ANYTHING and probabaly won't be until the finale.

http://presentedwithcomment.blogspot.com/2011/08/doctor-who-more-like-river-song-show.html My review, because I'm a shameless whore.

Posted by: Katie at August 29, 2011 4:05 PM

Okay, here we go. I had a lot of issues with this episode. It was another one I really wanted to like but just couldn't.

First off, they rushed through River's progression from villain to friend so quickly that I found it completely unbelievable. Let River be a brainwashed psychopath for a few episodes longer at the very least instead of rushing through her change over the course of 30 minutes, for heaven's sake. Moffat seems to want to do so much at once, with tons of villains and tons of plots that it's just plain distracting and we lose out on the emotional end of things.

Which brings me to the fact that character-wise I don't buy that River is their daughter at all. I'm not sure if it's Karen Gillan's acting or the writing, but there was no emotion at all when they found out Mels was their daughter and then witnessed her trying to murder the Doctor. Really? That didn't bother them a bit? And Amy only convinced them to stop torturing River after the Doctor pointed out that her daughter was being hurt. I need to start seeing a LOT more emotion coming from these new relationships because right now the lack of it's grating.

I also agree with the critics who say that Amy and Rory are far too passive right now. I understand that River is significant to say the least, but Amy and Rory need to stay active and stay important otherwise we aren't given a reason to care about them.

@Paddydog - My understanding was that Amy and Rory's timeline was changed when they went back to the 1960's and River escaped the orphanage. Therefore Amy's original childhood that we were familiar with was no more. I'm not sure if that's the case or not, but that's what I took away from it.

Posted by: beckster at August 29, 2011 4:10 PM

beckster:

1. Thanks: I missed that and it makes a lot more sense to me to see it that way.

2. I was okay with Amy being disconnected from what was happening with her child because she's been disconnected from Rory, the so-called love of her life, for most of the episodes they've been in. I'm not sure Amy is able to fully feel for anyone other than herself, again part of growing up completely alone with an emotional wall between herself and the rest of the world.

Posted by: PaddyDog at August 29, 2011 4:14 PM

Also, (I'll shut up soon, I swear..) could someone point out when River mentions that she remembers killing the Doctor? I thought she had no knowledge of that whatsoever.

Posted by: beckster at August 29, 2011 4:15 PM

Are we absolutely certain that was young Melody shooting The Doctor in the spacesuit?

No. That's the problem. I checked again and the face under the visor seems smaller than an adult's (there's a couple frames when The Doctor says "it's okay, I know it's you".) Assuming it's always the same spacesuit, how'd the spacesuit get from 1969 to 2011, or vice versa. Was she screaming for help before or after Utah? (Again, if that IS Melody blasting The Doctor on the beach). I don't even care how she got to England from New York, the possibly misleadingly non-linear time travel is what's vexing me.

And, as River said in "The Impossible Astronaut", when she first me The Doctor he knew all about her. They jumped the track, The Doctor is ahead of her and they're not parallel anymore, making a bunch of time now unaccounted for (to say nothing of the 200 years between The Doctor learning of his death and then inviting himself to attend it).

I had to lie down yesterday.

In the end I simply realized that there was no way to confidently piece it together now, Moff's twisted it all again and I'm just gonna have to wait.

I am intrigued by the theory that SOMEHOW River is also The Doctor's mother. Oh there's evidence, circumstantial or misdirection, but even though their televised relationship has been tame I think the implied sex would make Moff think that was a step too far. Oh well, it's fascinating to read the relationship in that way anyway.

Posted by: Jay at August 29, 2011 4:19 PM

Thanks a heap Jay. beckster had just straightened me out and now you've confused me all over again.

Posted by: PaddyDog at August 29, 2011 4:29 PM

River delivered the diary at the reception; if Melody was there it would have resulted in a paradox. I'm not saying Melody knew about this, necessarily, but it's a minor plot necessity.

(Although Rose met Baby Rose, and not much happened... whatever.)

I also agree with @beckster. New childhood timeline for Amy and Rory.

Posted by: ShagEaredVillain at August 29, 2011 4:44 PM

My biggest issue was with the introduction of Melody as Amy's childhood friend. It seemed like Moffat had to figure a way to get River into the Tardis and into 1936 so he made up this never before mentioned friend as an afterthought.

I also don't like Amy's detachment. I get that she didn't have a chance to bond with Melody/River on a mother-daughter level, but if my best friend from childhood was being tortured by some mini Justice League, a third party wouldn't have to tell me to step in and do something about it. It's weird. It's like she and Rory have switched personalities from the beginning of their story to now. First she was active and he was passive, now it's the other way around. The old Amy was feisty. Maybe Madam Kovarian did something to her when they had her for all that time.

Posted by: Carolina Gril at August 29, 2011 4:47 PM

the episode sucked balls. I hate the actress who plays river song. she is an old woman who tries to act young and mischievous but fails. also, I wish doctor who would take a break from these multiple-episode-length mega adventures to smaller, better stories like Blink with the weeping angels.

Posted by: kerokan at August 29, 2011 5:09 PM

Ok, @Jay. Just to clear up something. The Silence took Melody because they want her to operate a TARDIS of sorts and the Space suit is obviously the "machine" that takes her between time and space. And I agree with Robert's take on the time line (in the recap). But remember adult River shoots at the space suit. Is that what caused young River to regenerate? That she was shot by adult her? And also, River knows why she is in jail and that she killed the best man there is and she has said that over and over. But newly regenerated Melody/River may know she killed the doctor but she is still conditioned to kill him at all costs. Also, I didn't notice this until I rewatched it, but Melody said the last time she regenerated she regenerated into a toddler in NYC. Also, she stated she was going to age backwards to freak people out and so she obviously can play with her age. I don't know, that's my 2 cents. I will say that I loved the ep and I screamed when Mels regenerated. It was wonderful. I think I'm going to go watch it again.

Posted by: Swellegant at August 29, 2011 5:12 PM

Okay here we go again... and since this has been a while I'm getting into detail,

1. A pox on BBC America for continuing the very needless and stupid Amy-narrated intro.

2. Question: How many stories could young Amy have told young Mels? Answer: ONE. One story about a crazy guy in a blue box who crash landed in her yard and ate her food. That's it. She didn't have any other adventures. So the fact that Amy was so steadfast to the Doctor all those years was bad enough, Mels doing so vicariously through that one story even moreso. Yes she was conditioned by the Silence, but up until this point as far as Amy knew she hadn't ever interacted with the Doctor. The idea of an assassin is to keep a low profile, not be constantly bringing attention to yourself- and certainly not to tip her hand that she knows the Doctor better than Amy does. Later on after Amy and Rory came back she could have heard some stories, but that still doesn't explain the teen years.

3. While Doctor Who has plenty of involuntary discontinuity and as such some storyline paradoxes, this ongoing storyline of Moffat's is changing from a ball of "wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey" to just a Ford Prefect squashed in a junkyard crusher. I'm sure Moffat thinks he's being so very clever but it makes much of the time in between set-up and payoff to be more frustrating than an enjoyable wait. Would it kill the showrunners just to have a few unconnected adventures? Not everything needs to be connected with everything else. Just have a couple of romps just for fun.

4. When I first saw River Song back with the Tenth Doctor, I kind of liked the idea of future Doctor companion. It wouldn't even matter if we never heard her story or saw her again, it was still kind of neat for the Doctor to meet someone who for once knew more than he did. But with every visit she's been further grating on my nerves. and I have no doubt she's going to get worse before we finally get her full goodbye.

5. It's nice to see someone taking the concept behind Meet Dave and executing it far better than Eddie Murphy did. Now we have TWO alternative candidates of what we will see dying in place of the Doctor- The Flesh aka "Doctor Goo" and now a perfect android copy. Either one would require a burning of the body to hide that it isn't the real Doctor. I am curious if the Doctor wouldn't use this as an opportunity to go from universally known time traveler- to a mere rumor of a dead man. "What? you saw the Doctor? Can't be. He's dead." His enemies wouldn't bother planning things against him if they thought he was dead. He could potentially renew his reputation to an urban legend.

6. Equally nice to see Rory getting more respect as a character. He gets to sock Hitler, he's the one who figures the miniaturization, and out of the three of them, he's the one who has the most realistic reaction to Mels regenerating into River. Him I think I'll miss when he goes. Amy and now River not so much.

7. Strange that I should think back to the lone Eighth Doctor adventure where the Master takes time to needless redress into an outfit more Time Lord-ish. That's kind of what I felt watching the Doctor change into a tux for really no reason. About all he needed to say is that he always dresses for the occasion.

8. I agree with others- I really don't like that Amy "friend" Mels just magically got thrust into continuity. It would have been so much better if she had already made a few innocent appearances along the way. Kind of like how John Saxon made several blips before eventually finding out it was the future version of the Master coming in a few seasons ago. This backstory was shoehorned in as an afterthought and its in many ways rather insulting. By this logic you could wedge damn near anything you want in at the last second anytime and there would be no payoff for watching the first 12 episodes.

9. Nice reference back to the Fourth Doctor story Hand of Fear, where it is claimed weapons cannot be used within the TARDIS....etc. Pity it had already been disproved many time in between stories, but still nice to reference the old stories.

10. Thanks to all the constant meddling by the Doctor, I really do not see a chance in hell of Amy, Rory and I suppose Melody at having a happy ending short of some cheating. Not that I wouldn't mind. I'd like the Doctor to be shown that sometimes he really does make things worse, and all the continued involvement will not fix it. Matt Smith is still not my favorite Doctor, but I have to say he tries to be the best he can in the role and while the stories are often not the nicest to fit into, if they have any shortcomings, it's really not his fault.

11. So now the Silence is now not just the creepy aliens we saw at the beginning of this season, but now an entire religious movement consisting of really anybody searching the answer to an unknown question that would probably bring Douglas Adams back. Again, I'm smelling another shoehorned cheat. What the hell are the aliens we thought were the Silence called then? Between them, the Weeping Angels, the Future Church/Army, and the Headless Monks, there are an awful lot off religious references being crammed in.

I'm going to lie down for a while.

Posted by: bleujayone at August 29, 2011 5:18 PM

"why did Mels’ entrance remind me of an entrance that River Song might make?"

Except that she actually hits the Doctor with her car.

Posted by: Roderick T. Long at August 29, 2011 5:33 PM

I thought this episode was really funny...just because you HAVE to have seen previous episodes just to get some kind of...loose grasp on what the heck is going on.

My sister knows of Doctor Who just because I rant and rave about it sometimes. She's seen a few episodes, and the ones that she's seen, she loves. She always ends up watching them just in passing. She's walking from one room to the other and sees it on.

While I was watching this one...she had NO idea what was going on, but was still glued to it. She watched it all the way through with strange expressions on her face, while every now and then she would look at me as if asking me, "What the fuck does all this mean!? Who's she again? That's her daughter? HUH?" But not in a bad way.

Posted by: Candee at August 29, 2011 5:34 PM

@kerokan:

"I hate the actress who plays river song. she is an old woman who tries to act young and mischievous but fails."

48 years old is an "old woman"? In what universe?

I find her far more attractive than Amy.

Posted by: Roderick T. Long at August 29, 2011 5:35 PM

1. A pox on BBC America for continuing the very needless and stupid Amy-narrated intro.

What? I was thrilled to not see it... maybe I should look again...

I find [River] far more attractive than Amy

A thousand times, ditto. I have never liked the character of Amy, and now even less-so. Gilliam is pretty, but not extraordinary IMO, whereas Kingston seems so fiery and interesting.

Posted by: Patty O'Green at August 29, 2011 5:44 PM

Is that what caused young River to regenerate? That she was shot by adult her?

No, I think that nothing happened because she was shooting at herself and so the spacesuit appeared to be unharmed. "Of course not", she says, meaning, apparently, you can't kill yourself.

Posted by: Jay at August 29, 2011 5:45 PM

I don't care what anyone says, I love River Song. And I can forgive any slight plot inconsistencies because River was there, Rory was brilliant (I am so glad he's getting things to do) and so was the Doctor. River did do a quick turn around but I choose to believe that the TARDIS and the Doctor told her very interesting/important things to make her do so.

The things that annoyed me most about the episode were 2 comments the Doctor made: one about women and one about the robot being ginger. They just didn't seem very Doctor-ish to me.

Posted by: TS at August 29, 2011 5:45 PM

Shut up, he's dying!

Posted by: Jay at August 29, 2011 6:21 PM

I wasn't a fan of the beginning of this ep. As soon as Mels barrelled in and they called her 'Mels' I assumed she was Melody anyway and we'd have an explanation and the Doctor would be all confuzzled. Only then she allegedly wasn't Melody but their wacky friend we've never heard of before. So damn weak. It screams of making it up as they go along. Think how much more affecting that revelation (such as it was in this case) would have been if Mels had been in the show from the beginning. Even as a tiny character who is mentioned and seen around a few times or at the wedding. That would have blown my mind. Instead we're given a rushed flashback and I was just waiting for the moment they figured out who she was.

Thankfully the rest of the ep got better (once Hitler was inthe cupboard, I found that lame as well) and the ending was nice as it at least explains why River dies when she does. That's a nice touch an it's making me want to revisit her first appearance. Still think they can't have known for definite who she wasand how she fit in when they wrote those library eps, but it's nice they're trying to tie it up some.

Posted by: Carrie at August 29, 2011 6:32 PM

they can't have known for definite who she wasand how she fit in when they wrote those library eps

No, he didn't.

Posted by: Jay at August 29, 2011 6:39 PM

To answer the question a few of you asked, in the scene where justice-robot-Amy informs Melody of her crime before The Doctor arrives, Melody acknowledges what the robot said regarding her killing The Doctor but states that she only has a hazy awareness of it. I don't think she would be talking about the poisoned lipstick; she should have a very clear memory of that. Watch the scene again; it's a quick line, but I think it seems to indicate that the crime is already in her past and that she did it.

Add the fact that the justice robot has in its official record that Melody Pond killed The Doctor at that exact time and place in Utah, and you have a very compelling body of evidence. Granted, the justice robot's records could be mistaken.

Aside: was the justice robot acting outside its usual procedure punishing Melody before the designated end of her timeline? According to the mission statement that their captain gave us, it would seem so. Perhaps she's such a notorious criminal who is difficult to catch that they made an exception for her. Consider this: would they be punishing her for the crime before she even committed it within her timeline in the vein of Minority Report? That would seem to be even further outside their procedure.

Also consider that the space suit was a specially constructed item built to sustain its inhabitant for the express purpose of killing The Doctor. That doesn't mean it must be one-of-a-kind or that someone else couldn't use it, but at this point Ockham's Razor points to young Melody Pond pulling the trigger.

That said, Moffat could be engaging in misdirection. Her lack of a clear memory of the event casts doubt, and I think it's still possible that young Melody, future Melody, or someone else entirely could be in the space suit.

That's a good point above about the scene yet to come with River Song in the Madame Kovarian eyepatch. Much remains to be seen...

Posted by: C. Robert Dimitri at August 29, 2011 6:44 PM

One other detail that stood out that I did not mention above:

Why did the TARDIS interface tell The Doctor that regeneration was not an option for him and that death in 32 minutes was a certainty? Is this due to the nature of the specific poison she used, which I'm guessing that Melody had squirreled away for years during her time in Leadworth? That seems the simplest and most probable explanation.

Posted by: DarthCorleone at August 29, 2011 6:59 PM

bleujayone >> Regarding point # 5 that you make (I enjoyed reading all of your thoughts)...

I think "Doctor Goo" or a robot impostor would be a substantial cop-out. It's just too easy of an answer in my opinion to work as the overarching mystery that dominates season six, and I would hope that Moffat has something much more clever up his sleeve. You could also question why it is that the murder of a fake Doctor would need to be maintained as absolute truth throughout the universe at the cost of River's reputation and freedom. And keep in mind that The Doctor we saw shot did attempt regeneration before being definitively killed. I suppose the appearance of regeneration could have been faked as well.

Posted by: C. Robert Dimitri at August 29, 2011 7:23 PM

I'd be perfectly happy if they got rid of Amy and River and The Doctor just traveled with Rory. Right now he is far and away the most compelling character on the show.

Posted by: DominaNefret at August 29, 2011 7:58 PM

Here's the actual conversation:

Amelia Pond, Judgement Death Machine: You killed The Doctor.

River: Oh, yes I know, dear. I hope you're not going to keep on about it. Oh, regeneration - it a whole new coloring to work with.

Amelia Pond, Judgement Death Machine: You killed The Doctor on the orders of the movement known as The Silence, an Academy of The Question. Do you accept and know this to be true?

River: Quite honestly, I don't really remember. It was all a bit of a jumble.

*Mouth Ray*

So, it could mean that she killed The Doctor when she was little and doesn't really remember. But she was very confident with her first answer. She talked about things being jumbled after Amelia Pond, Judgement Death Machine said the part about WHY she killed The Doctor.

My interpretation is that when River admits to killing The Doctor she's talking about right then - in 1938. Since she's been brainwashed, she's not sure why she wants to kill him, she just knows she must and doesn't care enough to remember about The Silence and all the religious stuff.

I think the adult River was in the space suit when The Doctor dies. The Melody in Florida escaped the space suit and somehow made her way to New York. So when she regenerates as Mels, she's a toddler who still hasn't killed The Doctor. So somehow Mels the toddler makes her way to Scotland (?!) to find Amy and Rory because she knows that eventually The Doctor will show up (how else was she going to find him?) and then she can kill him. Which he does, and she does.

Feel free to make fun of me when this turns out to be totally wrong. And I just want to point out that I was totally right, even River thinks her name is stupid.

Posted by: Three-nineteen at August 29, 2011 8:22 PM

@C. Robert Dimitri

Could it have been a result of the TARDIS console being shot? I can't remember if the TARDIS itself has any effect on regeneration but that might be another possibility.

Posted by: beckster at August 29, 2011 8:31 PM

Three-nineteen >> Yeah, now I think I misinterpreted that line. You're correct that what she's not clearly remembering could simply be the original brainwashing and nothing more. Mea culpa. That could be young Melody in the space suit, but I no longer consider that the obvious Ockham's Razor solution.

That said, if she did not already kill The Doctor in Utah, then those time cops are potentially creating a paradox by trying to punish her in 1938 Berlin and thus preventing a fixed point from happening. Of course, their punishment could simply be a reaction to the poisoning that just took place, but that seems like they are going outside their mandated jurisdiction a bit.

Ugh. Timey wimey.

Posted by: C. Robert Dimitri at August 29, 2011 8:32 PM

beckster >> Historically, The Doctor's ability to regenerate and ease in doing so depends on a number of factors. It is possible for him to regenerate without being safely inside the TARDIS (see Tom Baker to Peter Davison), but TARDIS conditions seem to be the most ideal for him in providing a safe transition. We have also been told that it is possible for a regeneration attempt to fail if the injury is particularly grievous. (See Peter Davison's near-miss when he also was poisoned and became Colin Baker.)

If The Doctor's regenerative powers were not going to beat the poison, why would River's? Is it the fact that she gave him all of her regenerations instead of just one?

Posted by: C. Robert Dimitri at August 29, 2011 8:39 PM

Ok I just thought of something that no one ever thinks of. WHAT caused the young Melody in NYC to regenerate. I mentioned that when she was in the suit and may have killed the doctor that one of River's bullets (essentially adult her) shot her and caused her to die and regenerate. Maybe? But then when Amy shot the suit the girl was ok. That's what has me curious. What caused her to regenerate the first time? Was that answered and I just missed it?

Posted by: Swellegant at August 29, 2011 8:49 PM

@C. Robert. River was already in the regeneration so she could come back from being shot by the Nazis. 10 regrew his hand, etc. I imagine that by healing him it was probably bad enough that it took all her regenerations, but it was still possible. The TARDIS couldn't regenerate the Doctor because it was still repairing itself from the crash. At least I think...

Posted by: Swellegant at August 29, 2011 8:51 PM

I had a big ole long entry, but it got wiped out, so here's some smaller stuff.

1. I think that since history keeps getting rewritten for Amy Pond because the universe was rebooted, it's not too surprising that she was an orphan with no friends when we first meet her, and has parents and Mels now.

2. I think there is a regeneration of Melody that we haven't seen yet. There's no way that the 7 year old white girl in 1969 regenerated into toddler Mels. That would make Mels about 20 years too old to have grown up with Amy and Rory. And how did a todler get from New York to Scotland and find her parents. Mels is pretty young when she meets up with the young Amelia Pond. So I think there is a regeneration between 1969 child and Mels.

3. I wanted evil River to hang around for a few more episodes. She would have been like a female Master that you could turn to the good side.

4. Why did the judgement robot need antibodies? Why would you even build that into the robot? And how was it talking after all its controllers beamed out?

5. Why didn't the Doctor regenerate? It seems he can and cannot regenerate at the will of the writers and that pisses me off. I also don't understand how River doesn't die from wearing her own lipstick, but a quick peck on the lips does in the Doctor.

6. I want to see the Doctor travel alone with Rory and fight the Master. Yeah, I want to drool over cute men. 2 out of 3 ain't bad.

Posted by: BWeaves at August 29, 2011 8:56 PM

7. I'm also betting on Dr. Goo being the Doctor who got shot by the astronaut.

Posted by: BWeaves at August 29, 2011 8:58 PM

i read the animorphs story about somebody traveling to hitlers time they found hitler but in this universe time period he had never done anything wrong in his life and yet they still killed him they wiped out this mistake when they reset the time travel device.

Posted by: Utah Dynamo at August 29, 2011 9:08 PM

Amy and Rory live in Leadworth not Scotland. Amy's Scottish family moved there. She's the Scottish girl in the English village remember?

Posted by: Katie at August 29, 2011 9:17 PM

Thank you, Katie.

Posted by: Jay at August 29, 2011 9:37 PM

Doctor Who break Creep brain...

/drool

Posted by: Uriah Creep at August 29, 2011 10:51 PM

I'll suspend judgement until I see the episode*, but I started to lose patience with this season prior to the break. There were so many twists, red herrings and reveals flying around regarding characters I care less and less about**, that I am close to quitting until they sort it all out. Was the plan to turn DW into Lost? Not that I mind Lost, but it's not what I have come to expect from DW over the years and the transformation isn't really working for me.

The individual adventure episodes have been forgettable- beyond the problematic episode involving The Flesh, I struggle to recall much of the rest. I don't mind season long arcs, but it seems as if Moffat spent so much time constructing his puzzle box that he forgot to include the characterization and escapist fun at the core of DW.

*Fookin prawns have migrated to Australia don't air until next week. Before your start, I prefer to watch it on tv than by download. I'm a creature of habit in that respect

**good observation on the passivity of Rory & Amy

Posted by: Dave Shepherd at August 29, 2011 11:27 PM

A couple of other thoughts...

When the Justice Bot scanned the TARDIS, it displayed the ship's make, model, origin and status including that it is stolen. At first glance one would think it's status is such because the Doctor did indeed steal it "or permanately borrowed it" or as the TARDIS's avatar suggested, it went with him willingly.

But since they crew of the "Bot already knew about the Doctor's history and were in actuality hunting for River, I almost wonder if the TARDIS's status as stolen was so because they knew Mels/River had hijacked it (hence stole it)? It makes one wonder how detailed their history (future) of the Doctor is.

Secondly, let's be honest here. The Doctor's death is already very much a cop-out. We already know he isn't going to be dead. Because if he were, there would be no show. And since we already know it's been renewed, the question isn't that he's going to die, but rather how does he get out of doing so, and what did we actually witness.

Unfortunately, I feel this season (series) can only end one of three ways regarding the Doctor's demise; 1. It really isn't the Doctor. It is either someone or something else made to look like the Doctor. And I can only guess that he would fake his death to end this alleged war on him by the Silence, 2. This is somehow a dream in Amy's head, a simulation of what might happen if one would go to war with the Doctor, (I swear if Amy wakes up with the Doctor in the shower, I'm angrily going to Cardiff the day after) 3. It is the Doctor, but he somehow has already prepared for this and either has a magic reset button in much the same way he reset the universe or is setting up everyone for the previously mentioned fake.

For some of you uber Whovian geeks, option three would borrow heavily from the Eighth Doctor's comic book storyline versus as similarly themed enemy called the Threshold, complete with both faked death and regeneration. I seriously hope it isn't, but the NuWho has already been caught borrowing from other media formats before.

Posted by: bleujayone at August 30, 2011 12:06 AM

Ok I just thought of something that no one ever thinks of. WHAT caused the young Melody in NYC to regenerate. I mentioned that when she was in the suit and may have killed the doctor that one of River's bullets (essentially adult her) shot her and caused her to die and regenerate. Maybe? But then when Amy shot the suit the girl was ok. That's what has me curious. What caused her to regenerate the first time? Was that answered and I just missed it?

Posted by: Swellegant at August 29, 2011 8:49 PM

I think she was sick. I haven't rewatched it, but I believe I recall her coughing. She was a little homeless girl in an unsympathetic time in a bad season in New York City. I felt like it was implied that she got sick living on the street and was dying of whatever she had (flu, hunger, consumption, plague, what have you...).

Posted by: coryo at August 30, 2011 12:26 AM

ok this might sound nuts-but what about the Doctor #10 that was left with Rose? Is it possible that he regenerated into a #11 at the same time and maybe HE is the one that gets shot?

ok Pajibites, tell me the many ways that is a crazy thought

Posted by: JillyL at August 30, 2011 12:42 AM

Dave Shepherd, if you've already forgotten the episode with House you're missing out.

Posted by: Anne At Large at August 30, 2011 12:44 AM

Ten that was left with Rose is a human. He can't regenerate. But then Rose shouldn't have been able to leave her parallel universe either like she did when actual Ten died, so there you go.

Posted by: nix at August 30, 2011 7:45 AM

Amy doesn’t live in Scotland. We first meet her when she moves with her family to a small village called Leadworth in England. (Katie also has posted this).

Amy meets Rory and Mels in Leadworth. When Amy marries Rory, they remain living in the same village.

To all you Amy haters, sorry to let you know but the U.K. press has already said that she has signed with Matt Smith for the next season (no mention of Rory that I know of).

“I think there is a regeneration of Melody that we haven't seen yet. There's no way that the 7 year old white girl in 1969 regenerated into toddler Mels. That would make Mels about 20 years too old to have grown up with Amy and Rory. And how did a toddler get from New York to Scotland and find her parents. Mels is pretty young when she meets up with the young Amelia Pond. So I think there is a regeneration between 1969 child and Mels.” (Bweaves)

When Mels is regenerating into Melody in Hitler’s office, she herself says, “this happened before when I was a small tot in New York.” That means she must have regenerated into Mels at that time – however Melody Pond says on looking at her new face inside Hitler’s office, that “I’ll take the age off a bit”. So would assume Mels had the power to manipulate her age particularly as she mentioned that she searched for ‘years’ to find her parents Amy and Rory.

“Why didn't the Doctor regenerate? It seems he can and cannot regenerate at the will of the writers and that pisses me off.”(Bweaves)

Neat that the Doctor’s regeneration powers have been disabled, thus saving him from regenerating into the new form of Doctor 12 (may that day be a LONG way distant!).

“I also don't understand how River doesn't die from wearing her own lipstick, but a quick peck on the lips does in the Doctor.” (Bweaves)

Melody has developed a tolerance to the poisonous and hallucinogenic lipsticks over the years intentionally so she can use them as weapons. Snake charmers (and other animal handlers) intentionally inject themselves with small amounts of venom over years to make themselves immune to poison.

I just loved this episode of Doctor Who and the Doctor (as played by Matt Smith) just keeps going deeper into my heart. It was just so much fun and brilliantly conceptualised. I am already on multiple watchings and expect more.

The only wish I have is that there are regular standalone episodes throughout upcoming seasons – I don’t always want to be on the arc!

My only complaint is I DON’T LIKE THE DOCTOR’S NEW GREEN COAT – much prefer his tweed jacket.

Posted by: Meenakshi at August 30, 2011 8:40 AM

I was astonished by how boring I found this episode. I am completely over the whole Amy/River/Rory mess and wish they would all go away. Especially Amy, but really, I just have no more interest in the whole storyline.

Posted by: Todd at August 30, 2011 11:17 AM

Honestly?

I kind of love that they just left Hitler in the cupboard and never mentioned him again. Fuck you, Hitler. You stay in that cupboard.

Also, I think River kills Rory. Not sure why. There were so many misdirects in the earlier half of the season alluding to the Doctor but meaning Rory ("It's mine" about the cot, not Melody, the whole "stupid face" ordeal) why not throw in another one? All River said is that she killed "the best man I ever knew" (paraphrasing), and plenty of people say things like that about their fathers.
I am fully aware this "theory" is barely thought through and full of shit. Thought I'd share though.

Posted by: Erin S at August 30, 2011 11:47 AM

Thanks Katie. I meant Leadworth. A Scottish accent always causes my brain to drool with delight. Anyway, my point was that a todler on the run from The Silence would not have been able to get themselves from the USA to Leadworth in 1969. There had to have been another adult Melody between the little girl and Mels.

Posted by: BWeaves at August 30, 2011 11:52 AM

I think I've finally figured out what's bothering me about 11's run as Doctor. It's always about "sorting out Amy." River and Rory are just part of "sorting out Amy." Few of the stories are actually about where the Doctor lands, with the companions along as sidekicks.

Also, while River could kill Rory (and who hasn't killed Rory at this point?), the Judgement Bot specifically says that River killed the Doctor.

When Mels is regenerating into Melody in Hitler’s office, she herself says, “this happened before when I was a small tot in New York.” That doesn't mean she was the little 7 year old girl we saw in Ep. 1 the previous time it happened necessarily. That girl wasn't a tot. Oh well, time travel. Who knows if they'll fill in that backstory.

Posted by: BWeaves at August 30, 2011 12:05 PM

Also I like that a white girl (young Melody Pond) regenerated into a black girl (Mel) and then into a white women (River). This bodes well for future non-white Doctor incarnations.

Posted by: Cimorene at August 30, 2011 1:35 PM

The one big puzzle the episode threw at me is in retrospect why didn’t River Song recognise the astronaut suit in 1969 when she visited Florida with the Doctor? She genuinely was puzzled by the suit, but how can that be as we know now that she herself was the girl in the suit. Can anyone explain it to me . . . slowly!

Just read that Moffat admits that this season is arc-intensive, but has promised that next season will have lots of stand alone episodes and they will start filming episodes for the new season in February.

Now if they would only dump the Doctor’s new green coat, I would be completely satisfied.

Posted by: Meenakshi at August 30, 2011 3:36 PM

I didn't mean that I didn't like Amy; I like her quite a bit. I just like River more.

Posted by: Roderick T. Long at August 31, 2011 3:21 PM

my point was that a todler on the run from The Silence would not have been able to get themselves from the USA to Leadworth in 1969.

Well, not without help. But we know the Silence have a TARDIS.

Posted by: Roderick T. Long at August 31, 2011 3:24 PM

I still think the man River kills is Rory. As she said it was "the greatest man I've ever known" sounds like a daughter talking about her dad (at least when her dad is the fantastic Rory)

Posted by: Travis at August 31, 2011 3:37 PM

In a way Mels WAS not Amy and Rory's wedding...Amy see's River Song walk past the door during the reception. So somehow a later regeneration of Mels was there...now as for why already had that form I'm assuming it's because that's the form she had when the Doctor reset the universe...yes?

Posted by: Nikki at September 1, 2011 8:40 PM

Unfortunately, the Doctor with Amy and Rory and now Mels/River is terrible.

I couldn't even watch the entire episode, turning it off halfway through and canceling my season pass.

I've disliked Amy as a character and a plot point for the entire run, and it has only become worse, not better. And, I don't hate Matt Smith as the doctor, but he isn't great and paired with Amy is terrible.

Hopefully this will be Amy/Smith/rory's last season and they will re-launch back at the BBC with a new doctor new companion, b/c this ensemble is destroying a great franchise.

Posted by: Kerminy at September 6, 2011 8:53 AM