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"What's Your Excuse?" Mom Got Her Toned Ass Banned From Facebook

By Joanna Robinson | Miscellaneous | November 27, 2013 | Comments ()


Screen Shot 2013-11-27 at 9.11.07 AM.png

Accomplished fat-shamer, Maria Kang, went so far in her campaign against “obese women” that she got herself banned from Facebook. Impressive!

Maria-Kang-issues-First-and-Final-Apology-for-Whats-your-excuse-post.jpg

In reaction to a recent campaign from Curvy Girl lingerie which featured non-models posing in the company’s product, the charming mother of three wrote the following.

I am motivated by constant body (fat) acceptance campaigns strewn all over the internet followed by comments with the context of ‘you go girl!’ and ‘more power to you!’ The popular and unrelenting support received to those who are borderline obese (not just 30-40lbs overweight) frustrates me as a fitness advocate who intimately understands how poor health negatively effects a family, a community and a nation.

And that got her banned. Though I think Kang needs to take it down a peg or fifty, I’m actually surprised this elicited a banning. I’ve seen much more hateful language on Facebook. Kang’s non-apology entitled “Sorry but not sorry” reads as follows:

I feel completely misunderstood. While I speak strongly about making one’s health a priority, the very last thing I intended to express was any level of shame. No one should be ashamed of who they are, at the same time, in order to desire something greater, you have to -at some level - be uncomfortable with where you are at. When we normalize being unhealthy we create complacency to positively change.

I doubt anyone here is firmly on Team Kang, but do you think a banning was in order?



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Comments Are Welcome, Jerks Will Be Banned


  • mograph

    Here's a new obesity study: maybe it's not healthy.
    Caveat: it uses BMI, apparently.

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com...

  • Strand

    I'm getting some serious Michelle Malkin vibes from this one.

  • WillSmithSpreadsAids

    I would ban the sexy Kang in my bedroom til Charles Ramsey discovers her.

  • mograph

    This is interesting. Maria's website indicates that her heritage is half Malaysian-Chinese, half Filipino. According to the Geert Hofstede centre, the cultures of both cultures are collectivist, and shame is often a motivator in collectivist cultures.
    Although there's no indication that Maria has spent much time in either culture, her parents may have been influenced by them, and she may have been influenced by her parents as a result. This might explain why she would have thought that shaming would be an effective tactic.

    (Note that I'm talking about cultures, not races. Also, If her parents had lived in the US since their infancy, this theory wouldn't hold much weight, since the US is an individualistic culture, where shaming doesn't have the same motivating effect.)

  • I have a friend who has 3 kids and became a fitness model and instructor in her mid-40s. She is an inspiration to me, partly because she has never shamed anyone about how they look. She encourages people to live healthfully. I won't ever look like her, for lots of genetic and medical reasons, but she inspires me to get stronger and healthier. THAT is how you go about it.

  • Walt Jr

    My Mother earned a PhD, and taught Pilates in the freaking 80's. Not near as impressive as those fake hair extensions and spray tan though....

  • Az

    Hmmmm the first time I saw that picture and read "what's your excuse" my immediate reply was" Birth control that actually works".

  • Guest

    I really hope all the fat people who celebrate the banning will use the energy and start moving, even if its only to throw away the unhealthy food.

  • DeaconG

    The problem is that the woman has no empathy.

    What she also does not understand that if you wish to be an evangelist, you must have humility. What she is in the process of doing is obscuring the message and making the messenger the focus, and that will not do.

    As someone who had his own journey from darkness to light (once 235 lbs, under meds for type 2 diabetes, high blood pressure and high cholesterol, now 160-ish pounds, no longer on meds for the diabetes), I have also noticed the changes in my own worldview when I see people who are obese in the world. I have to remind myself that once upon a time, I was one of 'those' people and that I must not be judgmental of them.

    Once upon a time I had people who were concerned about my weight and my eating habits and I tuned them out because I thought I was doing 'just fine'; even after I was diagnosed with my diabetes. My epiphany did not come from being 'shamed' or 'harassed' into losing weight, it came because I reached a point in my life when all of the little hints that my body was giving me over the years finally caught up and convinced me that if I did not change, I would die. Full stop.

    You cannot put a gun to someone's head and insist that they have to do what you want them to-you may find a loaded gun pointed at your own head with your own issues being highlighted. You have to not only convince them that they must change, you must be able to use your own journey to give them the strength to start, then give them the support they need to continue.

    Being a dick about it is a good way to cause people to despair of changing their condition, it now makes you the wrong kind of change agent; instead of them saying "Yes, I can do this!" they say "Oh, the hell with it, it's too hard, I'm tired of being castigated, what's the point?" What does that make YOU at that point?

    When I walk on my bridge every day and I see those who are heavier than me, I don't look at them with pity, I go out of my way to encourage them. "You're doing fine, keep it up!""You can do this! Stay the course!""I've been there, you're on your way!" That's how you get people to begin to change their lifestyles, not jumping down their throats with both feet while showing off your sculpted body and waving reports about how being fat is a bad thing. THEY KNOW THAT ALREADY.

    I post on a photography forum that has a thread for those of us who are trying to lose weight, I do the same thing. It's about encouraging, it's about passing on knowledge that helps them, it's about helping them get to where they want to be.

    I know this is too damn long anyway, but to close out: Ms Kang; until you gain some empathy and humility, until you stop being the problem and start being the solution, SHUT YOUR FUCKING PIE HOLE.

    I'm done. Sorry about that.

  • Sars

    She is doing ALL* this in hopes of a book deal or a tv show. And she'll probably get it.

  • malechai

    Dear Ms. "Fit Mom": I'm the EXACT person your
    message is targeted to: I'm overweight by about 50 lbs. I have enough
    money that I could eat vegetables more and potato chips less. I have a
    bit of free time, but I don't exercise enough.

    I'm not PROUD of these facts, but I'm not sobbing about them in my
    Tostitos either. The fact of the matter is I have a pretty stressful
    life. What's stressful about it isn't any of your business. I eat
    chocolate chip cookies because sometimes life JUST REALLY DEMANDS
    CHOCOLATE CHIP COOKIES. Accusing someone like me of celebrating or
    glamorizing an unhealthful lifestyle because from time to time I might
    feel happy or even proud about my appearance is ignorant and again,
    really none of your concern.

    You can be on Facebook if you want - I can choose not to Like
    you and completely ignore your sad little existence. In fact, I would
    prefer it, so I can see if any friends of mine Like your page, in which
    case, they would become un-friends pretty damn quickly.

    I'll see your "sorry-not-sorry" and raise you a "thanks-but-no-thanks".

  • Lindsey Gregory

    Banning was totally unnecessary. That said, she has a great body and it's commendable to do that with three young kids. However, I think she basically cancels out her own message by being so judgmental and condescending. You never know what people are dealing with. Yes, obesity is a huge (pun intended) in this country, but there are better ways of motivating people to lead healthier lives than shaming them.

  • **I AM** NotTheOne

    Why does she need to be banned from Facebook? Can't people just block her if they don't want to read her nonsense? That's what I don't understand.

  • Maguita NYC

    Because that would be too sensible.

  • **I AM** NotTheOne

    Yeah. You're right.

  • purplejebus

    I love Kang. Shame on all you hosers! Ban me you lame bunch of dissatisfied, whiny bitches. This site has gone to complete shit in the last year.

  • foolsage

    I see you felt confident enough to post that under your own name. :)

  • dxp2718

    Nobody's normalizing "being unhealthy." In fact, normalizing *thin* is actually normalizing "being unhealthy" for a lot of people: people starve themselves or do otherwise unhealthy things in the name of being thin. Thin is not the same thing as healthy. And yet, our society normalizes being thin. Post a picture of you working out at the gym and cooking a healthy meal, and then we'll talk. But equating one's body with the health of one's lifestyle is wrong, and there's the problem. When people are unhappy with their bodies, they employ various unhealthy coping mechanisms and actually become less healthy. Accept different body shapes first, then promote healthy lifestyles. Don't assume because someone is fat that they're unhealthy, just like you shouldn't assume because someone is thin that they're healthy. It's correlated but the relationship isn't causal. An unhealthy lifestyle can cause fat, and isn't always the cause of fat, but once you're already fat, you can become healthy without becoming thin, and in fact are often more healthy if you don't try to become thin.

  • Jenn TheYellowDart

    So the page advocating the assassination of President Obama stays open (despite a massive campaign and thousands of complaints), and *this* is who they chose to punish? Beautifully done, FB. *slow clap*

  • Maguita NYC

    Finally! Someone states the obvious mismanagement of FB guidelines and PC-ness. I've been reading comments and hoping that anyone would point out specifically how horribly unfair, no matter if you agree with the little air-head or not, that she's being banned for calling everyone not conforming with her views on health fat, while pages upon pages of threats on the President, threats on women for reporting rape, depicted decapitation and all sorts of hate propaganda go on unpunished no matter how often they are reported.

    The question should be: Why is a woman touting her views on health, again no matter how narrow and lacking in empathy we may find her to be, was quickly banned while FB had stayed any proper actions when it comes to death threats and hate propaganda.

  • Jenn TheYellowDart

    Yeah, I have no love for this particular woman's views however there is an even bigger picture to look at here in regards to hate speech and harmful Facebook pages.

  • dizzylucy

    I find her annoying, but not deserving of a ban for that.

    Her approach is what bothers me. She went out of her way to find and criticize a company whose product starts at size 12 (a size many healthy, fit women wear), and who had the gall to show their actual customers wearing their products.

    I also don't care for her being critical of those offering supportive messages on the ads. It strikes me as her thinking that people are cheering for obesity, which I really don't think is the case. Being supportive of people with varying body types is not about accepting obesity, but about supporting people for who they are, not what size they wear. And in this particular case, I think it would be words of support to women who had the self confidence to model the products, knowing they don't look like the typical very thin (and then photoshopped even more) women usually used to sell clothing.
    If she wants to help people get in better shape and eat more healthily, that's awesome, but this aggressive approach towards people who didn't ask for her help or her opinion is a big turn off.

  • Joe

    The banning seems excessive but she seems unpleasant, so eh.

  • Some Guy

    How many of you who dislike and seek to disregard this woman's opinion actually took the time to look at her Fb page?

    The page that is clearly set up for her to promote her business.

    A business that focuses on losing weight and being healthy.

    Isn't this the point where someone points out that rather than being offended by this woman's opinion on a page she set up to promote her business, you could just ignore it and move on with your lives?

    Do you like finding things to offend you?

    FB shut down her business page and deleted the post in question, then blamed it on computer error.

    Bullshit. FB is notorious for allowing and not allowing certain pages based solely on the politics/message behind them. Somebody got pissed, complained to someone at FB who in turn got offended, and censored her.

    The only thing some people love more than debating a contrary opinion is silencing it because it's offensive to them.

  • Uriah_Creep

    Do you like finding things to offend you?

    That's pretty much the purpose of the Internet, isn't it?

  • JustOP

    Articles like this designed to stir up easy controversy generally lead to people spouting uninformed opinions and the evertiresome 'I'm Offended!' card.

  • Premie

    I don't think banning was harsh enough. We need to silence those who would fat-shame and make other people feel bad.

  • Dear Toned Mum,

    Keep your opinions to your own self. No-one gives a shit.

    Sincerely,
    zeke the pig

  • ZbornakSyndrome

    May I buy you the fried candy bar of your choice?

  • Some Guy

    Her opinion was kept to herself. It was posted her on business page on FB, which is there to promote her opinions on health and eating.

    It's the people who find her opinion offensive who keep bringing it up and then complaining about it.

  • Evolve Today

    Crazy how that goes both ways.

  • gutpunchprod

    Team Kang. The fact that she was banned proves she touched a nerve.

  • foolsage

    I think the banning was excessive and unnecessary. I don't however agree in the slightest that the banning somehow proves that she didn't deserve to be banned. I can "touch a nerve" by writing all sorts of offensive things; the fact that I "touch a nerve" doesn't mean that my writing was valuable or should be defended.

  • IlseBC

    While the banning over that comment may be on the extreme side, the only real difference between what she said and the other horrific comments people have posted in that she worded it politely. There's no difference in meaning between her statement and "I can't believe people are so supportive of these woman being fat!"

  • mograph

    Boy, is this complicated:
    - the popular body "norm" is thinner than a healthy norm
    - a body heavier than the popular norm is negatively evaluated
    - this negative body image is carried over to a negative self-image
    - sometimes size or apparent weight has nothing to do with fat content
    - a healthy weight range is wider than many people believe
    - visibly overweight people do not need to be reminded of that fact
    - there's gotta be something in the food causing this
    But …
    - being morbidly obese cannot be healthy
    - being unhealthy affects a person's choices, and by extension, their role in society
    Personally, I wish we all ate healthy, were clear-minded and led physically active lives. And I wish we were healthy enough to eschew pharmaceutical and surgical solutions, where possible.

    At any rate, in my opinion, fat-shaming just doesn't work. (I don't know how well *any* kind of shaming works in an individualistic, non-Confucian society.) She shouldn't have been banned (but she's back?), but she should just let it go. Maybe she should just be an example of healthy living under stress, instead of directly attempting to shame her targets.

  • Evolve Today

    I'm sorry, but is "obese shaming" a thing now too? How do you defend obesity? It's a 100% negative thing, is it not? She seems to be attempting to motivate people to better themselves rather than making fun of them for it. Granted she would have been hidden from my facebook because, good lord, preaching is annoying no matter what, but come on now.

  • ZbornakSyndrome

    Let me start by saying, she didn't deserve a ban, that was silly.
    I don't think she's attempting to motivate, I think she's bragging, which, fair enough. She's also a personal trainer, I believe, which means that it's very literally her business to look like that. Some people spend 8-10 hours behind a computer (hi!) for work, and, well, it's not a job that leads to rock hard abs unless you're super motivated.

    While obesity is not something that should be celebrated, I don't think shame and mocking (by pointing out that they have no excuses and shouldn't be modeling underwear) is the way to help them. It usually just causes more binging.

    But if someone came up to me at a bar and said that drinking scotch was bad for me and that they hadn't had a drink in 20 years and look how fabulous they looked, I'd find it unnecessary and annoying.

  • Welldressed

    @ZbornakSyndrome I love you. This has nothing to do with your stance on this topic, but solely on your username and general demeanor. I also agree with you on this topic, but that's beyond the point.

  • ZbornakSyndrome

    Welldressed, you're making me think the internet is a safe and wonderful place full of lovely people - clearly, this is a trap. Thank you for the compliment! I quite like you too.

  • Nail Polish Color

    She's gloating, not motivating, and seems to be going out of the way to remind people who don't look like her that they are lazy -- you know, cause there TOTALLY aren't people who have medications that cause them to gain weight, nor is there depression, or anything else, its just them being lazy.
    she went out of her way to find a curvy lingerie page to shame people, you know, a company trying to make lingerie to fit what most women look like whether she likes it or not.

  • Evolve Today

    Shockingly, I doubt she's talking to people with outside issues causing it. And your edit makes no sense, because her comment directly refutes your "what most women look like" statement.

  • Nail Polish Color

    thats why they dont make plus sized clothing, cause nobody wears it. She isnt exactly spreading a message of positivity, which is my point. she is going out of her way to be antagonistic.

  • girlinabox

    I think she's ignorant, but that statement doesn't seem ban-worthy.

  • Some Guy

    Ignorant of what? The shocking obesity rates in our country and the resulting health care costs associated with treating a nation of unhealthy, overweight people?

  • Pawesl

    Th thing with the banning is you have no idea how long she has been acting like this a spewing hate at overweight people. You are only hearing about the last thing before her banning not all the garbage that led up to it. This was probably a long time coming for her.

  • Steve Ward

    "Not just 30-40lbs overweight" is what saves her.

    Though I feel kind of sad for her that it seems her entire self-worth is wrapped up in how flat her stomach is. I put much greater value in someone being a good person than I do in being in fitness model shape. Kudos to you for being in shape. But using your 0-3 year olds to celebrate your workout regimen and feel superior? Just what exactly is missing in your life where THAT seems like a normal thing to do?

  • Some Guy

    I think it's sad that you assume she thinks her entire self-worth has to do with her stomach.

    Seems to me having three kids would necessitate, but not necessarily guarantee, that she probably puts just as much self worth into being a mother as she does what appears to be her job/health.

  • Shannon G

    Kang's opinion doesn't come anywhere close to being hateful. This whole thing is beyond silly and people who can't take a long, hard look at themselves are falling all over each other to see who can be the most outraged by one woman's opinion.

  • Do I think it's deserved? Probably not, since there is plenty of other people saying things way worse on Facebook daily. Am I delighted? Oh golly gosh darn yes I am!

  • Art3mis

    I entirely disagree with her, but I don't think she should have been banned. Facebook has a notoriously poor track record of responding to actual hate speech, including death threats, rape threats, and entire hate pages directed at fat people. This lady, while vile, is nowhere close to the stuff they've deemed acceptable in other instances.

  • Some Guy

    How can you entirely disagree with the sentiment that being obese is a bad thing?

    Because it is. And lord knows all I hear about is how fat America is.

  • Nail Polish Color

    Harsh ban, but I'm too fat to be motivated to come to her aid ;)

  • I think bans happen often and it likely depends on how many people are reporting her and she has attracted a lot of hate. I don't think what she said qualifies her to be banned from fb. She is a person with technically good intentions, but she has an extreme negative attitude towards overweight people, and negativity or shaming will never solve the obesity epidemic.

  • Shlee

    The problem is, she has zero idea about "health" if she thinks LOOKING a certain way constitutes health. I'm a fat girl, and all of my cholesterol among other things are within normal limits, I'm fit as a fiddle to be totally honest. Telling people that they have to exercise and lose weight to be healthy is DISINGENUOUS. I know people who are super skinny and whose cholesterol levels, blood sugar levels, etc. are terrible, who are smokers and who are in poorer health than I am.

    If anyone ever tells you that they're concerned about your health because of your weight, punch them in the throat and never talk to them again, because they're just trying to shame you for looking a certain way that doesn't live up to their personal expectations of beauty. They're not concerned for you, they're concerned with what they have to see, which is shallow and ridiculous.

    Though I will say, I don't know that what she said was ban-worthy for sure.

  • ScienceGeek

    I worked for a cardiologist who was adamant that being overweight really only exacerbated existing health issues, except in cases of extreme obesity. In his mind, obesity was just another symptom of the REAL causes - diet and fitness, and he was incredibly frustrated by his patient's focus on their weight. Thin does not equal healthy, in fact, being extremely thin is just as bad as being extremely overweight.

    A 2003 London study found (and I quote, because I think the author has put it really well):
    "Lean men and women (BMI <18 kg/m2) experience increased all cause mortality compared with those with a BMI between 20 and 22 kg/m2.
    This pattern is not seen for cancer mortality, but is found for
    cardiovascular and respiratory diseases. It is important
    that public health messages regarding
    healthy eating are aimed at maintaining a healthy body weight rather
    than just “losing
    weight”. "

  • Zoe1078

    I'd love to see the data your cardiologist was looking at when he claimed that being overweight was not a health concern, because that's not what I learned in medical school. Obesity is directly related to diabetes, arthritis, heart disease, sleep apnea, strokes, multiple forms of cancer--the list goes on and on. And while it is true that there are illnesses caused by being underweight, the number of obese patients is vastly higher than those who are underweight in the US. Not to mention that when I advise patients to lose weight for the good of their health, it is via healthy eating habits and exercise patterns, and I never advise people to become underweight. Both are health problems, and the goal should be in the middle.

    Edit as a relevant FYI: obese individuals do not need to reduce their weight into the "normal" range to improve health outcomes. Just a modest 7% loss improves reduced rates of complications (ie 21 lb for a 300 lb person).

  • ScienceGeek

    I'm not sure where you got the idea that the cardiologist I worked for was not concerned about being overweight. All I said was that he considered it an exacerbating symptom of the real cause (diet and fitness) and was frustrated at the attention given to body weight at the exclusion of other factors. Given that you also advise your patients to change their eating and exercise habits, could you please explain exactly how you disagree with his stance?
    Put it this way: if simply being fat was the problem, you'd advise them to get liposuction, not watch their diet and get some exercise. So is it your opinion that the weight is the true cause of their health problems, or did the poor diet and lack of exercise lead to BOTH their disease and their obesity?
    Perhaps the other point of contention is the difference between causation and correlation/exacerbation when it comes to the term 'directly related'. To use one of your own examples, arthritis (as I'm sure you know) is caused by an auto-reactive T-cell being released into the circulation and initiating an immune response against parts of the joints. Fat plays no role in this process, but it does increase the burden on those inflamed joints. Exacerbation, not causation. I could go into all the ways obesity is correlative rather than causative for cancer, heart disease, sleep apnea, stroke and diabetes, but it'll probably bore the shit out of everybody, and I'm kinda in a food coma right now. I'm happy to discuss it later, though, if you'd like.

  • Zoe1078

    I see that I misinterpreted your comment, but I do think this thread in general has minimized the importance of obesity and its role in disease. I come from the standpoint of primary care, in which weight control prevents the complications of many diseases as we both mentioned above. In that sense, the distinctions between causation and corellation are somewhat academic. The role of T cell mediation in arthritis is certainly there, but on a practical level, when I counsel an arthritic patient on what they can do to improve their pain level, weight loss is high on that list (via healthy eating and exercise, just as you said, not via liposuction). Or if I am trying to prevent a patient from getting heart disease or diabetes in the first place, weight control is again at the top of that list. Or if I counsel a patient on ways to eliminate their type II diabetes, weight loss is again the first thing we discuss. Correlative or causative, weight loss is still important.

    I'm alarmed by the number of people on this thread (not you) who claim that their health is fine because their cholesterol level is normal, as if that isolated value is a comprehensive proxy to overall health. You are very right that poor diet and lack of exercise are at the root of the issue, but I have heard too many patients minimize the risks of their weight due to perceived healthy diet and ample exercise (in my experience, people vastly overestimate the vigorousness of their physical activity when I dig into details).

  • ScienceGeek

    I understand. I read a few of your other comments and realised you're a primary care doctor, had one of those 'Ah, now I get it' moments, and hoped like hell my reply hadn't been too blunt.
    You're right when you say that for you, causation and correlation aren't nearly as important as improving the patient's outcomes. 'My' cardiologist was also involved in research (where we're all annoyingly anal retentive about that distinction), and clinically, he regularly ended up operating on 50 year olds who'd later admit that they'd never had their cholesterol tested because 'Only fat people have to worry about that!'. Hence his frustration.

    Your entire second paragraph just reminded me of how our research subjects used to exaggerate their 'good' behaviours and completely downplay their worst habits. My *favourite* was a woman who bragged about being in the Guinness Book of Records for surviving the most aneurysms, but couldn't go an hour without demanding a cigarette break. I salute you for resisting the urge to slap them!

  • Zoe1078

    Yes, that's it exactly. Being "anal" about things like correlation and causation are extremely important in research, but for the patient sitting in front of me, all of that goes out the window, and all I really care about are their symptoms, outcomes, and ability to function.

    As an aside, you'd be shocked the number of times I've heard my patients say that they're firing another doctor because s/he had the gall to "tell me I'm fat, all they told me was that I needed to lose weight and eat better, I'm never going back again." Obviously bedside manner is a big issue here, but if your own doctor can't tell you to lose weight, Ms Kang doesn't stand a chance.

  • ScienceGeek

    In my first week on the job, I had a woman tell me she never told her doctors that she smoked a pack a day because 'they just tell me to quit'. Apparently, those cigarettes hadn't played in role in her three separate bypass operations (double, triple and quadruple). I'm surprised I didn't up with a wood-grain forehead, with all the time I spent head-desking.

    That said, I wonder if people like Kang are part of the reason doctors have such a hard time convincing their patients to lose weight. It's pretty obvious that Kang is using 'health concerns' as an excuse, and she's really all about making other people feel like shit. By the time they're patients, they've had years/decades of this kind of crap and maybe they've developed a kind of expletive-ridden Pavlovian rejection response.

  • Zoe1078

    I'm going to say the unpopular thing and expect to get down voted, but the context is that I am a primary care physician in an urban area with very high obesity rates. I have almost never thought a patient was better off at >30-40 lb overweight than they would be without the excess weight. Even if an obese person's genes and exercise level and diet will keep them from getting a heart attack, stroke, diabetes, etc from their excess weight, they may well develop sleep apnea, arthritis, or other less deadly diseases.

    In fact, I have as many women of normal weight ask how to gain more (which would put them at risk for obesity related health problems like high blood pressure, diabetes, heart attack, and stroke) as I do women patients with anorexia or bulimia. In my area, obesity is so common that I and my colleagues often have to remind ourselves that our "skinny" patients are actually healthy sizes since we're so used to seeing obese patients. In my community, the aesthetic ideal is for curvy hips, buttocks, and breasts, and the ideal body types tend to be overweight or obese. And the bottom line is that obesity is a risk factor for many serious illnesses.

  • L.O.V.E.

    Here is a new study to share with your patients:

    http://www.latimes.com/science...

  • JustOP

    It's come to something where facts are considered 'unpopular' because people can't stand that their feelings get hurt.

    Honestly, if people want to believe to themselves that being fat is okay, then go for it. But when they advocate that being fat is healthy, it affects other individuals. And that isn't right.

  • ZbornakSyndrome

    In my experience, It's just such narrow concern. Like Uncle What's His Name only cares that you're fat at Thanksgiving/Christmas/Family reunions, it's not like he calls you every Tuesday asking how your exercise regimen is going.

    Basically, it's something to say, that they can get away with, because they're hiding the insult under the guise of "concern". If they really cared they would, you know, check on you outside of family social gatherings.

  • JustOP

    Except being fat does have negative implications on your health. That fact is pretty obvious if you were to consult the large majority of scientific journals on the matter - of which has no interest on whether being fat is attractive or not.

    Please don't make the argument that you are healthy because 'you know people' who are skinner and unhealthier. Colloquial evidence isn't a great source of use, and you're making a pretty bad point regardless.

    I'm NOT saying that fat/overweight/chubby etc people are unnatractive. Many of them are beautiful people. But being obese or overweight puts you at risk for health problems and that is a fact - regardless of whichever beauty standards are currently held.

    I also don't think it's fair to tarnish everyone under the same brush for showing care if someone is putting on weight. I've seen and known people put on weight and have suffered due to it. That isn't me being selfish about how they look - that's me caring about someone I know.

  • JGSOLID

    I agree, my wife is an RD and constantly explains how many of the patients she works with in hospitals have ailments that their weight only enhances. I was 40 lbs overweight when we met and she never said anything to even suggest I wasn't beautiful in her eyes. She just called me out on eating habits I knew were not good and made diet suggestions. She got me hiking with her, got me back into surfing (because its awesome) and never forced me to do anything I never loved doing in the first place. 40lbs later and I have never felt better.
    Of course she is a professional working in a clinical setting, her job is challenging, and knowing that certain dietary habits enhance diseases and such is something that drives her.
    This chica however, has nothing better to do other than troll and work out. She is an asshole to the fullest, especially since she isn't putting herself out there as someone who could help you.
    I do agree with her however on the PC habit of telling every overweight person that there bodies are fine just the way they are. They are not, I mean you may be beautiful, you may be comfortable, you may be the lovliest person, but you are not healthy and if you are everything else then I want you to be healthy because you deserve to live a long life. Like my wife says, you don't need to be skinny, that can be just as bad for you, you need to be healthy, and there is no such thing as a 40lb overweight person that is healthy. Only those whose weight has yet to effect your health in noticeable ways. Yet, they have been affected, and their is no doctor who will tell you different.

  • Kate at June

    Unless you are a doctor or have access to an individual's medical records and blood tests, you cannot tell if someone is healthy or not just by looking at them. Ever.

    With fat people, we assume we can. And that isn't right.

    As a general rule, sure, obesity can lead to health problems. The exceptions to the rule are people who are medically obese but who exercise and eat well and are in perfect health despite a larger body size. So let's stop the stereotyping.

  • JustOP

    Your first point is ridiculously narrow-minded. Yes, there are times that you can tell if someone is healthy or not without being a Doctor. Examples: Lung cancer patient (first hand experience), stab victim, or obese person.

    These people are ALL in an evidently unhealthy state. Obesity and being overweight have negative affects on the human body. They place undue stress on many of the bodies functions. I am speaking with knowledge from a medical background, which is my family.

    I assume by 'medically obese' you refer to something like bodybuilders on the BMI scale. They too have their fair share of problems.

    It's not 'stereotyping' to point out that having a certain level (or above) of fat on your body leads to health problems. It's just a sad reality of life.

  • Hazel Dean

    Except the BMI scale is an inadequate tool for health measurement.

    You can be fat and fit, as proven in this myth-busting program that aired on the CBC:

    http://www.cbc.ca/player/Shows...

  • JustOP

    Yes, I stated that the BMI scale was flawed and you agree, so what's your point exactly?

    I can't watch that show as I'm in the UK. I think you've missed the point of the entire discussion.

  • Hazel Dean

    You didn't state that the BMI scale was flawed in the comment I responded to; you didn't state that until later in the discussion. You just said that bodybuilders , who might be considered overweight on the BMI scale, also have their fair share of health issues.

    And so because you can't watch the video that uses science to support my statement, you just claim I missed the point of the discussion? How did you come to that conclusion - that same way you superficially generalize about fat people being unhealthy? Well, it sure is much easier to make assumptions based on a lack of information than to actually become informed.

  • JustOP

    No. Because your one television show doesn't negate years and years of scientific research. One lone voice in a sea of overwhelming evidence, analysis and investigation is not convincing.

    Having a certain ammount of fat on your body is unhealthy. Being obese is unhealthy. Visible fat is not the only fat on your body - it lines your arteries, heart, blood vessels, pretty much all muscles. Having a certain ammount is not good for you. I do not superficially generalize about fat people being unhealthy in any way. All I have said is that having a certain level of fat on your body is unhealthy.

    Put clearly - I am not saying that anyone with some fat on them are unhealthy. Just individuals who meet a certain criteria.

    http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/O... - Obesity is something that requires 'treatment'. I don't understand what your problem is with what I'm saying.

  • Hazel Dean

    My issue is that you are only looking at one piece of a bigger picture. Being "overweight" according to the BMI scale does not preclude one from being healthy.

    For those without the benefit of access to the CBC, the program I linked to is a science myth-busting program that specifically tackles the myth you are touting, that fat ≠ fit.

    It takes the host of the show, who is 5'6" and weighs 120 lbs, and another woman who happens to be a snowboarding instructor and who is also 5'6" but weighs 170 lbs. According to the link YOU provided, the BMI scale, if you enter each of their weight and height measurements, it says that the former woman is healthy and warns the latter that she is at risk for several ailments related to her weight, and is borderline obese.

    However, on the program, they are both given MRIs to determine how much body fat, including visceral fat (the stuff you mentioned that lines your arteries, heart, blood vessels, and muscles) they each have. The host? 5 cm squared (24 lbs) of fat. The snowboard instructor? 30 cm squared (44 lbs) of fat. Yet they are then both tested for their aerobic fitness levels using the VO2 max test. The results? The thinner woman had an aerobic fitness level of 38.1, whereas the fatter woman's was 57, meaning she is more fit. It is having a low aerobic fitness level that actually puts you at risk for certain health problems, not just being "fat".

    That is, of course, not the case for all fat/obese people, but to argue the opposite, that all fat/obese people are by definition unfit/unhealthy, is just as false.

    That is my problem with what you are saying, and with the pervasiveness of this myth.

  • JustOP

    I've already stated that the BMI scale is a flawed system - this we agree on. The link I provided wasn't meant to promote it, but merely give an example of an established organizations view on obesity.

    You're mixing up the terms of /fit/ and /unhealthy/. The definition of /unhealthy/ is 'harmful for ones health'. Which having excess fat undoubtably is, whether it's now or in the future.

    Again, a certain level of fat is bad for your health. A number of diseases are caused due to the ammount of fat cells in your body - not just your 'aerobic fitness'. These include diabetes, cancer, cardiovascular disease, fatty liver disease, strokes. The increased level of fat mass on the body also leads to problems - osteoarthritis, sleep apnea. And this doesn't even cover other problems that can arise from being overweight, such as depression, muscle pain, gallstones, erectile dysfunction - all assosiated with obesity. Your statement that low aerobic fitness being the only risk for obesity related problems is demonstratably false.

    This is all scientific fact. Regardless of what you believe from television shows - this is what trained professionals and years of research tell us.

    Your television show is flawed for a number of reasons. Firstly, it takes a professional athlete whom happens to have a fairly large percentage of fat on their body and then claims that the science is all wrong. Your example is an outlier to the norm - the vast, vast majority of people are NOT professional athletes, and it's disengenuous to suggest the notions your putting forward to them. Not only that, but you claim that her high level of aerobic fitness proves that she isn't unhealthy - which is false, it only proves that she has a high level of aerobic fitness. She is still at risk to a number of diseases and problems due to the weight she carries.

    Which brings us back to the main point - that having a certain ammount of fat on the human body is unhealthy. It does not promote health. It is 'harmful to health' - the very definition of unhealthy.

  • Hazel Dean

    My argument was only ever that you cannot determine the health of an individual based solely on the amount of body fat they have. They are so many other factors that directly affect one's health that it is an overly simplistic view to say that by virtue of being a certain size a person is most definitely unhealthy.

    The fact that this one individual I referred to was fit despite being fat just demonstrates that to generalize and claim that every fat person is unfit is untrue. I specifically said that this was just one isolated example, but to make broad statements claiming the inverse is *just as* disingenuous.

  • Wicked

    I agree, Im considered obese by the BMI chart(and just by knowing I have an excess of body fat mentioned by a the plethora of dietitians and doctors Ive gone to all my life), and I have all my blood test results in great condition and within the healthy levels, including triglycerides, cholesterol, healthy thyroid, etc

    Now, Blood work doesnt really PROVE in its entirety that an obese person is healthy, extra weight doesnt only affect your blood levels but also your bones and spine, because its not used to supporting so much weight. Sure now when youre young you might be excellent but its been proven extensively that in the long run, just like smoking cigs, being obese will negatively affect you. Its reality. Beauty and size doesnt have anything to do with this, you can accept yourself and so on, but ppl cannot negate the fact that if you have 60 pounds over your correct weight, other areas will be affected, including and most of all your spine.

    This is not shaming, I don't feel shame by accepting that this will become a problem. I don't think I have to be a size 4 to be healthy, being a size 10 or 12 is totally normal for a person of my height(based on my doctor's recommendations)

    There are other factors that obesity does affect, for example, higher chance of getting cancer, diabetes, thyroid problems, muscular and spinal problems etc etc etc

    Again, Im fat and I know im beautiful but I also know the risks that comes with being overweight/obese. It just goes beyond mere blood tests...IMO.

  • Kate at June

    You're right. The first point I was speaking specifically to weight, the topic at hand.

    If family members being in medicine is qualification enough for a medical background, then I am also speaking from a medical background! Woohoo!

    It's generalizing. It is stereotyping...you can't argue that it's not. Obese does not equal unhealthy. I acknowledge that more often than not, yes, it is the case that obese people are unhealthy. My point is, you cannot assume that--because that is a generalization and it is a stereotype--and unless you are THAT PERSON'S doctor, you're guessing.

    There are far more accurate factors in determining health than a person's weight. Obesity is based on the BMI scale, which is problematic to begin with as it doesn't take anything into account other than weight and height.

  • JGSOLID

    Assuming someone is unhealthy by looking at them is very much possible, especially when weight is concerned. Of course more importantly, unless you are their doctor it's rude and horribly judgmental. An arrogant and pathetic thing to do.
    Obese is not only based on the BMI, which no Dietician uses these days anyway. However, obese = unhealthy is generally accepted as medical fact. No doctor would say otherwise. Of course in a clinical setting the Dietician would probably say something like "your health is fine now, but if you do not lose weight you will see a loss in your normal body function." My wife tells her patients that they are healthy for a tad bit longer, that a healthy body cannot be obese because to get their you must be unhealthy.

  • MegP

    i really love the "your health is fine now, but if you do not lose weight you will see a loss in your normal body function." so many people want to blast, "I'm overweight, but I am healthy! So there!" It's so ridiculous. Sure, yes, you may be completely healthy now, but if you continue as an overweight person, your body will be affected. The long term effects of being overweight affect every system of your body. It puts extra stress onto your organs and therefore, your health will start to diminish. that is a fact. so, everyone saying they are overweight and healthy now, come back in like 10-20 years and see if you are still considered healthy. you cannot put extra stress on your body, especially your heart, and expect to continue on as a healthy individual.

  • JustOP

    Perhaps our argument is more of semantics then. I agree with what you say about the BMI scale - it is a flawed system.

    But when I say overweight or obese, I'm not really talking within the confines of the BMI system. I'm talking around 25-30%+ body fat (for a man at least, it's a little higher for a woman). In this scenario, I think it's legitimately easy to argue that being overweight is unhealthy.

  • bastich

    I was a chubby kid, and I had often received that "concerned for your health" speech from various adult male relatives, all of whom were chain-smoking alcoholics. If nothing else, I got some laughs out of the hypocrisy on display.

  • Matt LaCasse

    Absolutely agree. I'm not a skinny dude, but I'm far from unhealthy. The ban was an over the top response, but I doubt many people will feel bad for her.

  • simplysarah

    She was banned for like 2 days. Then FB reinstated her account and told her it was in error. I don't think she should've been banned for that at all. I've seen much worse on the site that is deserving of a ban and doesn't get one.

  • oilybohunk7

    I like an author that got banned on FB because she posted a picture of two babies with pumpkins painted on their assess around Halloween. I am not a huge fan of seeing baby assess but seriously?

  • Some Guy

    The post in question was also deleted from her page.

    Censorship, baby! It's the new American way!

  • Phil

    You have no freedom of speech on facebook, what you can post on facebook is up to the owners of facebook

  • Aaron Schulz

    why cant people understand that companies can dictate what is shown with their product, so many random trolls shout censorship about the stupidest things

  • ONIT

    Probably just several angry women reporting her account and the account was automatically closed. Simply shows how much she hit on raw nerves. People who have problems with their weight tend to hate to be reminded.

  • Melissa D

    I am a woman who has problems with my weight. I hate to be told I am a bad person/unhealthy/poor role model/etc because of it. A picture of me does not give anyone the right to make sweeping judgements about my personal character.

  • ONIT

    Exactly! I totally agree even tough it's obvious not everybody agrees: I have one down vote! I gained some weight, and I know it's unhealthy, so I do something about it. I don't need anyone to be judgemental 'cos common sense already tells me what to do. Such prejudice makes some people gain even more weight, and that's on the haters. However, I don't know her FB account. The picture is totally ok! If she rants and discriminates on FB, then it's not ok. Less is more sometimes.

  • vic

    I think the vote down was because some people misunderstood your last sentence as meaning "fatties should stfu," instead of "this is a painful thing and people can overreact." If I understand correctly, anyway...

  • Melissa D

    I don't remotely agree with what she said, but I don't think she deserved to get banned for it. If you banned every stupid comment on Facebook, there would quickly be NO Facebook.

  • foolsage

    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - misattributed to Voltaire

  • NateMan

    I thought that was Peter Griffin.

  • foolsage

    I'm sure he said that at some point, as well. ;)

  • NateMan

    And what happy world that would be! :)

  • NateMan

    Yeaaaaah, that just seems weird. Far worse racism, homophobia, and misogyny floats around FB, and this is what gets banned? Body-shaming is not cool, but by comparison it seems very strange.

  • Jenn TheYellowDart

    Pictures of mothers breastfeeding have been banned, as well.
    I find FB to be such a weird vast social experiment.

  • Bodhi

    That shit is lunacy.

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