blogspot
visitor
My Triumphs, My Mistakes: Lessons and Experiences From Comic-Con | Pajiba - Scathing Reviews for Bitchy People
signnew.jpg

Guides | July 31, 2007 | Comments (48)


This was my first year to attend Comic-Con International, a massive geekfest that overtakes downtown San Diego for a few days every July, and it was definitely a learning experience. For the first time ever, the event sold out completely, meaning that north of 125,000 attendees clogged the halls of the San Diego Convention Center from last Thursday through Sunday afternoon. The crowd marked a tipping point for the convention as it inched its way even further into the pop culture mainstream, in a move that’s both vital to the organization’s larger integrity and dangerous to its genre-oriented roots. What started out as an actual comic book convention — henceforth, the Con — now bills itself as “celebrating the popular arts,” and all the major movie studios as well as individual TV series are there to promote themselves to the swelling mass of fanboys and fangirls. It’s a sprawling, confusing, exciting weekend, but I can’t help but feel that something’s getting lost in the shuffle of media glitz and advertising hype, something intangible and tricky and hard to define.

Theatricality And Deception Are Powerful Weapons
I started my weekend at the Warner Bros. panel on Friday morning, and the sheer lack of content was indicative of the larger oddity of this year’s convention, namely, that there’s not much going on. A new trailer for next summer’s Get Smart was screened, followed by a brief Q&A with Steve Carell, The Rock, and director Roger Avary, among others, but that was the most interesting of all the clips. Nicole Kidman phoned it in with a taped message before a preview for The Invasion, but that movie’s less than three weeks from being released, and any footage of it won’t do anything to sway people from thinking it will suck (which seems likely). The segment about One Missed Call — a new J-horror remake based on the film from the deeply unsettled Takashi Miike, this one starring Edward Burns and Shannyn Sossamon — was so boring I started to feel bad for Burns and Sossamon, who sat there mostly in silence while we stared at them, wondering if anyone would ask a question. The few who eventually did were rewarded with iPhones, which sent a surprised rumble through the crowd, who were mainly pissed that such a cool gift went to people who asked questions of the stars of what’s bound to be a pretty shitty horror movie. Hell, if I’d known I would get an iPhone, I would’ve asked Burns why the hell he made A Sound of Thunder.

watchmenposter.jpgBut even the highlight of the panel was strangely anticlimactic: 300 director Zack Snyder took the stage to talk about Watchmen, and was joined by only two of the recently announced cast members: Jackie Earle Haley and Malin “I Showed My Tits in Harold & Kumar” Akerman, neither of whom spoke or answered questions. And I have to say, though I maintain that 300 was overrated in the fanboy community, Snyder definitely seems to have the passion required for the project. He talked a lot about how he wants to stick as closely to Alan Moore’s book as possible, keeping the 1980s setting and the R-rated violence. But that’s it. The gimme posters passed out in the swag bags at the door listed the film’s release date as March 2009. There won’t even be footage to preview until next year’s Comic-Con; this year, there was only Snyder and an open mic. And then the ultimate letdown: The rumored glimpse of Christopher Nolan’s The Dark Knight turned out to be just that. There was nothing at the Warners panel at all about the movie. The new teaser trailer you’ve probably seen already? Nope. An appearance by Nolan or Christian Bale? Nope. A satellite interview like the one Steven Spielberg and Harrison Ford did the day before from the set of Indiana Jones IV during the Paramount panel? Not a chance. The only stuff about The Dark Knight all weekend was some kind of bullshit viral marketing scheme involving Joker masks and skywriters that I didn’t have the time or inclination to follow. What gives, Warner Bros.? Are you worried that somehow the people who attend Comic-Con won’t care about your movie, so you feel you need to stoke the fires with confusing viral ads? Since when do those work? All I wanted was a glimpse of the trailer that was going to be released later that day anyway.

That was the Con: A lot of promise, and not much follow-through.

Berserker
I also attended the Kevin Smith panel on Friday night, which was basically just a chance for Kevin Smith to try and figure out how many times he could say “cocksucker” in 90 minutes (answer: even more than you’d think). He told a few stories that I don’t even feel like relating here, simply because I’m worried that typing out phrases like “caked in dog cum” will cause me to have the kind of nightmares I’d rather not experience. Needless to say, Smith is pretty good at doing whatever it is he does, though I’m starting to think he’s decided to stop actually telling stories on film and instead promote the idea of his own existence. He’s become an entity unto himself, like Jessica Simpson or something; he is on the verge of being famous simply for being famous. Sure, he’s made three great movies — Clerks, Chasing Amy, and half each of Mallrats and Dogma — but it might be time for the guy to step it up a notch. Also, for those interested: The Criterion Collection is going to reissue its Chasing Amy set with a bonus disc of documentaries and featurettes, though in a nice turn you’ll be able to buy just the individual bonus disc if you already own the film, so you won’t have to get ripped off by a company double-dipping. That’s pretty clutch.

Jittery Little Fellow, Aren’t You?
posehn1.jpgThough I guess that’s not quite true, or at least it’s only true of the bigger panels and “events,” like Marvel’s hyped unveiling of a mysterious box that turned out to contain … a replica of the Iron Man armor. Fantastic. The real fun of the Con could only be found by attending events in which you had a personal, emotional stake, or by simply seeing celebrities and (relatively) famous people around the trade floor. I bumped into John Gulager and Brian Posehn, and they were both kind enough to oblige for a photo, as was the unfortunate girl hired to model as Slave Leia in front of the life-size (one assumes) mock-up of Jabba the Hutt. leia1.jpgI’d seen the Jabba model while strolling the floor on Friday, but when I passed it again Saturday evening, there was a girl decked out in the infamous gold bikini, posing for pictures in front of the statue. Guys were darting up to her to get a photo, which is understandable, but some were just photographing the girl, which crossed the line from ironic/funny photo-op to creepy stalker behavior. I walked up and asked her if I could get a picture — I knew she wouldn’t be allowed to refuse, but I still at least wanted to act like she was a human being — and had what had to be one of the more surreal and depressing conversations I’ve ever had. I just wanted a fun souvenir, and since my inner 12-year-old was screaming at me to get the picture, I knew I would do it. I asked the girl if her job was weird, or interesting, or remotely fun, and she said, “It can get pretty weird, like the one guy who stayed for an hour.” Yeesh. I asked, half-joking, “Was he taking pictures or just staring?” She responded, “Kind of both, actually.” Holy hell. Poor girl’s basically stripping, only for way less cash and for even skeezier customers. There’s no money in being a Slave Leia.

I’ve Got Kitty Pryde And Nightcrawler, Too, Waiting There For Me, Yes I Do.
Like I said, most Con-goers were there for one special panel or another, one magical gathering of the cast and crew of a TV show or movie they loved. I learned this the hard way on Saturday morning, when I arrived at the Con at 8:45 for the 10 a.m. panel on “Bionic Woman” and found close to 1,000 people in line already for the same ballroom I needed. At first I wondered just why the hell this many people were interested in the “Bionic Woman” remake, which, though exec produced by David Eick of “Battlestar Galactica,” still looked a little weak. (And it is; good concept, decent execution, terrible dialogue.) That’s when it hit me that most of these people weren’t waiting for the “Bionic Woman” panel at 10, but the “Heroes” panel at 12:45, and were more than willing to sit through a few panels they didn’t care about at all just to have a good seat for the one they really wanted to see. I can’t exactly fault them for their level of devotion, though; that was pretty much my plan, as well, since I was willing to camp in the 4,000-seat Ballroom 20 and wait through the “Heroes” panel and even a TV Guide one (which was painful) just to see the “Battlestar Galactica” and Joss Whedon panels that afternoon. The line was terrible, but also radically different from Disneyland or some place you’re expected to queue up for hours at a time with total strangers, because strangers at the Con are usually easily excitable people who will begin to talk to you with no prompting about arcane bits of fandom. By the time I’d walked to the end of the line, I was ready to give up and just cut, since I was tired and hungover and trying to recover from lack of sleep (more about that later). I heard one of the abrasive hall monitors who was working the Con shout out that it was time to “scrunch up” the line to make it four people wide and funnel into the room, so I stopped about 20 people from the end of the line and just cut in. It seemed like the best thing to do, and I lucked out, ducking into line next to a girl wearing a “Firefly” T-shirt, meaning she was (a) a fan of the show I also loved but more importantly (b) hardcore enough to wear the shirt. And sure enough, she was nice enough to let me get away with cutting, and since we all filed into the room together, made a solid single-serving friend, watching my stuff whenever I went to the bathroom.

Going to the bathroom, by the way, was something I tried to do infrequently. The ballroom hit capacity for the first event and stayed full all day, and the line of people hoping against hope to get in later in the day grew so long even that had to be capped. Leaving for the bathroom meant getting a ticket at the door that would guarantee you admittance upon return, since anyone leaving for good automatically forfeited their seat to the next person in the insane line outside. I darted out occasionally for quick restroom breaks or to grab a soda or a muffin or an $8 tuna sandwich, but I mostly sat in that one damn from 9:45 a.m. to 5:45 p.m., and the only thing that kept me from going stir-crazy was the panels for shows/writers I loved. And no, I don’t mean the “Heroes” panel; that I couldn’t care less about, though the announcement that Kevin Smith would be directing an episode of “Heroes: Origins” and even Smith’s surprise appearance to take a couple questions on the matter sent “Heroes” fans into apoplexy. No, like I said, I was there for “Battlestar” and Whedon, and I enjoyed both, despite the fact that not much news was announced at either and most of the audience questions were pathetically lame or just downright stupid in their obviousness (e.g., the person who asked Whedon if the feminism in his works is intentional). The fun part of being in a room full of freaks like yourself, of people who seem to have gotten wrapped up in the same silly lives and stories of make-believe characters, is to commune with other outsiders. Sure, the hundreds of subcultures within the family hierarchy that is Geekdom can be occasionally ruthless in their antagonism, but that’s because nobody picks on my kid brother but me, you know? I was talking to a friend who happened to be in San Diego over the weekend for a medical conference, and he said he’d seen the Con-goers swarming Fifth Street at night. “I made fun of the people who were there,” he said, and of course he did; those damn geeks, with their TV shows and comic books and weird little worlds. Damn them for having the wherewithal to care about pop art. All they wanted was to drive across the country and geek out for a while in a place they could feel safe, where you can meet other freaks and shop for comics and watch TV shows and get a chance to ask a question of the writer, producer, or star who’s breathed life into something silly and fictional and somehow still great.

There Goes My Hero
light1.jpgBut it seems that this year, more than ever before, that chance for the geeks to assemble is being recklessly grafted onto the commercial machine of Hollywood. After spending Friday roaming the convention halls, I managed to tag along to three different industry parties that night, though my memories of each grow fuzzier as I try to piece them together chronologically: There was the DC Comics party at Deco’s, then the William Morris party on the roof of some hotel, and then some party at some club that sounded like Decapitation or Emancipation or Revelation or something. The parties were a fascinating mix of famous people, comic-book people, industry people, and the kind of blonde leathery Tan Diegan girls that scuttle around the Gaslamp district like slutty roaches. For instance, everyone took it in stride when David Arquette strolled through the DC party in a suit that appeared to have a skeleton sequined onto it, but at one point my coworker leaned into me and whispered with moderate excitement, “That’s Grant Morrison who just walked in and is standing behind you.” Only at Comic-Con is Morrison going to be more recognized and revered than a movie star.

But there were still stars there, and it’s weird to see them rubbing nervous elbows with men and women clearly not used to the atmosphere. Comic-Con now gives off a vibe of an uneasy partnership between the jocks and the geeks, as if the jocks realized how much money they could make off the geeks and thus invited them to sit at the cool table in the cafeteria. The whole event used to be a place where geeks went to get away from it all, but now it’s the place they go to have it sold to them by the grown-up versions of the cool kids they used to despise. I saw Andre 3000 at one of the parties, and I thought, “What the hell is he doing here? I mean, sure, it’s an agency shindig, but this is frakkin’ Comic-Con.” And then I thought: “Exactly.”

Daniel Carlson is the managing editor of Pajiba and a low-level employee at a Hollywood industry magazine. He knows he’s a geek, so don’t feel the need to point that out in the comments. Thanks. You can visit his blog, Slowly Going Bald.


Pajiba Love 07/30/07 | Fear and Loathing in Las Pajiba





Comments

Oh the Con. I started going in 2001 and even since then, it's grown, both in size and the amount of "hype" generated, immensely. It's still one hell of a weekend though.

Posted by: Kevin Longrie at July 31, 2007 7:06 AM

Speak for yourself, master Daniel.

The Dark Knight's viral campaigning was very ecititng for us nerds on the message boards piecing things together... of course the more savvy ones had alrwady seen bootleg versions of the trailer. And the obsessed ones went full-on deranged mode for not seeing any visual footage of the movie.

But what can you expect so early on?

Posted by: mish234 at July 31, 2007 7:47 AM

"... as if the jocks realized how much money they could make off the geeks and thus invited them to sit at the cool table in the cafeteria"

I think you've hit the nail on the head there.

I think there are other cons better worth investing travel and time in. I shall dub them Micro Cons. Like beer only with comics and anime. And we know Pajiba loves its micro brew. Yes!

Posted by: Rebecca H. at July 31, 2007 8:05 AM

The appeal of Kevin Smith truly boggles my fucking mind. He's quite possibly the single worst director of the last 30 years, his dialogue is pretentious and unbelievable, he can't write characters for shit, and he seems to have the thinnest skin of any "player" in Hollywood, witness his vicious attack on the late Joel Siegel.

I recently saw Clerks and Chasing Amy again, and just got bored by the horrible camera work and pretentious dialogue.

Posted by: Trevor at July 31, 2007 9:30 AM

I've gone to Comic Con for three of the last four years...this is the year that I skipped it, just because I'm on the other side of the country.

I found the trick to Comic Con to be just like you described - pick one or two things that you really want to do, and then commit to doing them (and only them).

A fun thing to do is to get a blank sketchbook and go around to artists, asking for sketches. Warning: this works best if you are a cute girl, less well if you are a socially inept, slavering fanboy.

I kind of miss going to Comic Con, though it seems to be getting almost too big for its own good. When will the expansion end?

Posted by: Mary at July 31, 2007 9:37 AM

Ah, The Dark Knight trailer appeared in the series of 10 trailers that I had to sit through before The Simpson's Movie. Even without any footage of the movie, I could not be more excited about the movie. It was the best preview of them all.

As far as Kevin Smith goes, I happen to love Dogma a little more than Chasing Amy, but only because Joey Lauren Adams voice is like nails on a chalkboard to me. I do fear that one day, sooner than everyone might think, he will truly be famous for being famous. I see the downfall beginning with Jersey Girl.

Sounds like a lot of fun to me.

Posted by: Melody at July 31, 2007 9:41 AM

"All they wanted was to drive across the country and geek out for a while in a place they could feel safe, where you can meet other freaks and shop for comics and watch TV shows and get a chance to ask a question of the writer, producer, or star who's breathed life into something silly and fictional and somehow still great."

I think that pretty much sums it up for the majority of "non industry" (regardless of what industry) folks who attend these things. I've been going to Gen Con ("the world's largest gaming convention") for the last 11 or so years and that's always how I've felt about it. Though, Gen Con is definitely a few notches below Comic Con on the Geek Heirarchy, making the attendees all the geekier.

I've been excited about "Watchmen" ever since Zack Snyder got the nod. Every interview I've read indicates that he really seems to "get it." Whether or not that will translate on screen is yet to be determined. I loved both the "Dawn of the Dead" re-make and "300". While neither film had much depth to it, they were both very entertaining and had an excellent visual style. While the source material wasn't nearly as deep or complex, I think he nailed "300". "Watchmen" is in a totally different realm, but he's received the benefit of the doubt.

I loved "Clerks", "Mallrats", "Chasing Amy", and parts of "Dogma" and even fewer parts of "Jay and Silent Bob". That said, I find Kevin Smith horribly annoying. I listened to all of 2 minutes of the commentary track in "Dogma" and had to turn it off. I think the assessment above is spot on.

I liked "Heroes." I was very glad (and surprised) that it did well. I love superheroes/comics and was generally pleased with the overall product and quality of the show. I watched every episode, enjoyed it, and will continue to watch. That said, I don't understand the craze behind it. It was good, but not that good. Oh well, I'd much rather have hype surrounding a show like "Heroes" than "America's Next Top Model" or something like that.

This whole geekdom into the mainstream can't be all that surprising, no? The generation of kids that were raised with Dungeons and Dragons, a resurgence of comic books, and video games (atari/Intellivision/Nintendo). That generation has grown up, started making some money, and pop culture is beginning to cater to us.

The chickens have come home to roost, y'all.

Posted by: Ajax19 at July 31, 2007 10:35 AM

That sounds like my idea of hell.

Posted by: Mary at July 31, 2007 10:45 AM

Absolute geek heaven. Wouldn't miss it.

Posted by: nancy at July 31, 2007 11:04 AM

Andre 3000 showing up totally makes sense, imo. He's cool as shit, but he completely fits the whole freaks-n-geeks profile.

Posted by: AdaHaze at July 31, 2007 11:24 AM

Props for the Weezer lyrics! It doesn't got more nostalgic than that song.

Also, I'm not surprised by Andre 3000 being at Comic -Con. He always seemed geeky-cool to me. Look at "Hey Ya!"

Posted by: Diana at July 31, 2007 11:43 AM

Okay, I'll admit it. Due to my slavishness to my geek side I watched every episode of "Heroes" because...well...it's the closest thing to an X-men tv show we'll get. But I have to say, I hated it. I watched it all but loathed every minute of it. They just executed everything horribly, the acting was horrible, the style was inconsistent, and the plotting was ridiculous (the whole middle of the show was completely uneventful and unrelated to the over arching plot).

But why is it getting the love? Is it because of others' geek sides as well?

Posted by: Chris W at July 31, 2007 12:25 PM

I admit, I'm a bit geeky. I'm not gonna dress as Eomer and wave a sword around, but I do love my video games, comic books, and sci-fi quite a bit. So I guess what I'm saying is... I'm damn jealous. Comic Con feels like... like seeing a game at Yankee Stadium or Fenway - it's just something I want to do before I die.

Posted by: TK at July 31, 2007 12:33 PM

From the other reviews I've read, the general consensus was "all fluff and some filler". I mean, how the hell could Warner Bros show up with nothing other than some crappy viral marketing? And Get Smart? I mean...huh? If Hollywood is going to grow more dependent on the comic book industry to provide it with more material, it needs to treat it with a bit more respect.

And TK, the end is nigh.

Posted by: Manny at July 31, 2007 12:42 PM

While I do admit that there were entirely too many people at Comic-con this year, I still enjoyed most of the panels I went to.



On Friday, I was at the WB panel too (but, the Paramount one the day before was much better), and when I realized that Zack Snyder was frighteningly boring as a speaker, I made my escape back to the Exhibit Hall. And around 12 I went to go find Neil Gaiman's panel, because at the early screening of Stardust the day before (yes I did make it in and it was fantastic), I realized that he's was a very interesting speaker with cool anecdotes, so following most of his panels was pretty fun.



On Saturday I went to Room 20 (for the bionic woman/heroes/bsg/whedon... etc panel) too. I love bsg, but I wasn't going to sit through a panel where we wouldn't glean very much new information. So I actually left my spot after bionic woman -a very prime seat at the front, right next to the camera- and went to the Rogue/Focus panel (where Gaiman talked about early screening tests for Coraline that evening -and apparently Coraline is done in stop-motion style) and then at the Disney panel they showed Prince Caspian (meh, I wasn't impressed with the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe in the first place) and WALL-E (which looked amazing, they showed us the first 10 minutes of the movie,...and left everyone very excited).



One other panel that I went to that really impressed me was the Sarah Connor Chronicles panel. They showed the entire pilot and it looked very, very good, with spot on dialog and plot (people clapped and cheered during every blackout transition to the next scene). You could tell a lot of people were perfectly willing to discard Terminator 3 and accept this new show to be the new canon (although the story takes place between T2 and T3). Moreover, Summer Glau was there, much to the happiness of a lot of fanboys. She was far more sweet and gracious than any of the big name movie stars I had seen for the last 4 days and it made me happy to see that she was comfortable with her fans and really nice to everyone.

Posted by: Vi at July 31, 2007 12:44 PM

Re: "If Hollywood is going to be dependent on the comic book industry to provide it with more material, it needs to treat it with a bit more respect."

Please.

The comic book industry is DYING.
10 years ago the best selling comic book was selling around 450,000 copies a month, and all of the top ten best selling books topped the 100,000 copies sold mark.

These days the best selling book barely scrapes past 125,000 in sales and you rarely have more then 3 or 4 books that sell over 100,000 copies per month.

Go into any comic book store and you will see far more trade paperbacks then individual comics.

And why should Hollywood respect the comic book crowd when comic book fans are some of the most virulently and disturbingly hate-filled AssJacks on the fucking planet. The shrieking and bleating and screeching from the "fanboys" has already begun over the announcement that the pirate comic sequences from Watchmen won't be in the film, thus rendering the movie, "a piece of jizz encrusted pig shit" according to the fanboy crowd.

The comic book fanboy crowd can go fuck themselves and while they're doing that they can buttfuck Kevin Smith and then stick their shit covered dicks in his mouth for him to suck and clean off.

Posted by: Trevor at July 31, 2007 12:58 PM

It's nice to see those anger management classes are working, Trevor.

Posted by: twig at July 31, 2007 1:05 PM

Interesting how intensely fixated you are on shit being involved with fucking, Trevor. Personal experience perhaps?

Posted by: Vi at July 31, 2007 1:18 PM

Yow--Trevor, that was harsh. Did a comics fanboy run over your dog/take your lunch money/break your heart?

Posted by: ohgrl at July 31, 2007 1:24 PM

Jesus, Trevor - you get picked last in geek class or something?

Although, vitriol aside, you make a valid point - the fanboy community can be particularly nasty - it's what drove me away from AICN in the first place. But your writing smacks as one of those fanboys/readers who has moved away from the community, but maintained all of the harsh, unpleasant nastiness.

Posted by: TK at July 31, 2007 1:54 PM

I also spent most of Saturday in Ballroom 20, and the TV Guide panel was as close to torture as I've ever been. Bionic Woman was just okay, but I'm willing to give it a chance in the fall. Heroes panel felt like a geek rock concert. And the Women of BSG panel lacked me some Sharon/Boomer. Sad panda.

Posted by: TL at July 31, 2007 1:57 PM

Oh come off it.

The fanboys shrieked and bleated about Superman Returns, even to the point of endlessly screaming that Supes costume was "the SUXXXXXXX."

They bitched and whined about V For Vendetta, particularly how the "ending ruined the movie forever!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

They've bitched about every film Marvel has put out, from Spiderman to Spiderman III and everything in between.

Same thing for DC and it's movies.

What's interesting about this is that the comic book/superhero genre type of movie was brought back from the dead by Tim Burton's Batman. I went and saw a special midn ight showing with my friend and was excited etc.

but you look at it now, and it sucks.

The dialogue is hideous, the characters have as much depth as a single sheet of toilet paper and Nicholson's scenery chewing performance ruins the movie. And it's just full of ludicrous scenes, the worst of which is the one where Joker and his goons take over the museum. It's beyond schlocky and makes the old Batman Tv show look like the fucking The Wire.

Posted by: Trevor at July 31, 2007 2:01 PM

Aw, poor Trevor didn't get enough attention with his first post, so he had to pretend to be a big boy and use all those bad grown-up words. It's okay, Trevor, we hear your little cry for help. Still don't care, but we hear it. It is nice that you proved you are just as much as a preening, judgmental fanboy as the people you complain about.

And, TK, that is simply because there are dickheads in all aspects of culture. Like sports fans. Are we to honestly say that your average sports team fan rivalry made more sense than most geek rivalries? Please. Just like with nationalism, race relations, and especially religions, there are always going to be somebody who thinks everything they do is right and everyone else is wrong. The only reason geeks get pointed out is because they do theirs in crazy yet quite creative costumes. And even then, the Pope is closing in.

I only hope that Dragon*Con gets as much love. This time, I am getting photographic proof that I touched Summer Glau and Alan Tudyk. Although those damn policemen might get in the way again.

Posted by: Vermillion at July 31, 2007 2:14 PM

You either like Kevin Smith or you don't, there is no middle ground, I happen to like all his stuff, but I can certainly understand those who don't. But to call him the WORST director of the last thirty years? After Lucas murdered the childhood of millions of us geeks with his HORRID prequels?

PS: Who the hell is David Arquette?

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at July 31, 2007 2:26 PM

Well, Trevor's other failings aside, I'd be curious as to where he's getting his figures from, and what they're figures *of*. Because ten years ago was right around the last days of the comics bubble. Comparing sales today - or at any other period, really - to sales during what has been acknowledged to be an abnormally inflated market is, well, pointless.

Beyond just that, it's important to know what numbers he's citing exactly. If he's talking about initial pre-release sales to comics stores, then of course they've gone down - a lot of those very stores were wiped out during the collapse of the comics bubble.

Not to mention that, since the Great Pop, comics retailers have gotten savvier (or, only the savvy ones survived - either way). Back in the day, crappy titles with enormous hype (Leifield, anyone?) were getting huge pre-release sales, sometimes for the the first three issues all together (and this before #1 ever hit the racks), but once the drek was released to general consumption, and the sales figures for the subsequent issues are examined (i.e., once we look at what the stores actually decided to order after the customers had seen the pig in the poke), there's a huge drop off.

These days, the remaining retailers aren't generally sucked in by the hype. They order in small, reasonable amounts, so sales *seem* lower than they did ten years ago. In reality, of course, the comic market is pretty healthy - what gets ordered ends up, almost entirely, in the hands of comics customers, unlike what happened with all those Leifield-era X-Men comics that can now be found in the bargain bin, priced cheaper than an equivalent amount of toilet paper.

The comics industry is doing fine. It went through a shake up in the 90s, and came out leaner and stronger. I could go on, but I won't.

Posted by: Landon at July 31, 2007 2:35 PM

Vermillion,

What a shock. A typical response from an Assclown fanboy. Instead of challenging my claims, (which by the way, you would lose) you resort to personal attacks.

That is such the spazzoid dork thing to do.

Posted by: Trevor at July 31, 2007 2:57 PM

Keep digging that hole Trevor...

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at July 31, 2007 3:18 PM

Ah, Trevor, another mature response. And calling me a fanboy and a dork (excuse me, Assclown fanboy and spazzoid dork) would be more effective back when I was 2. I might have actually shed a tear.

It is funny that you bring up your oh so wonderful 'points', Trevor, because I was just about to mention one. This trade paperbacks vs. comics thing you mention, isn't that kinda off, because aren't they the same? I mean, aren't trade paperbacks just comics in a more condensed form?

In fact, didn't the comics industry regain a lot of its previous strength by marketing trades in non-specialty stores, like bookstores and such? And if trades are so bad for the comics industry, are more and more comic books switching to shorter story arcs to facilitate easier collections?

Sure, the industry isn't as big as its heyday before Wertham and the HUAC, but they aren't limping around, either. And if the comic companies can keep their crap together and not pull another "Death of Superman" stunt, the outlook is pretty good.

As for your rant about the movies, are you saying that those you mention were good, despite what the fanboys said? What about some love for Ghost Rider? Or Daredevil? Or Catwoman? Or Fantastic Four? Don't they deserve a vigorous defense as well? Or maybe they just sucked because there was no respect for the source material. As for "V for Vendetta", the fact that the creator of the damn thing disowned it because of how his work was treated by movie studios kinda gives those screaming ninnies a bit of credibility.

And I believe Landon covered you other 'points' quite well. As for the personal attack, forgive me, I tend to do that when someone is being intentionally inflammatory instead of conversing like an adult. We get it: you don't like Kevin Smith, and you hate fanboys. Oh, and you know some swear words. I think the third post got that quite clear when the other two didn't.

Posted by: Vermillion at July 31, 2007 3:20 PM

Stupid Vermillion being the voice of reason!

Lemme get this straight - the guy who wrote this:

The comic book fanboy crowd can go fuck themselves and while they're doing that they can buttfuck Kevin Smith and then stick their shit covered dicks in his mouth for him to suck and clean off.

... is going to complain about personal attacks? Really?

Really?

Posted by: TK at July 31, 2007 6:10 PM

Nice report. I haven't been to the con since 2002, basically because of the negatives you mentioned. Since I live in SD, the con will always be there if I want it. But it really makes me never want to go again when it sells out like this and people talk about spending the whole time queuing up. Yikes.

Posted by: Gudrun at July 31, 2007 6:12 PM

Also, might I add, I love these two comments and how they ended up one after the other:

That sounds like my idea of hell.
Posted by: Mary at July 31, 2007 10:45 AM

Absolute geek heaven. Wouldn't miss it.
Posted by: nancy at July 31, 2007 11:04 AM

Ace.

Posted by: Gudrun at July 31, 2007 6:15 PM

I'm not going to get sucked into all the arguing that is going on right now, not really in the mood. Let's all just get along, then we can dance and sing and play hopscotch, oh what fun children.

Pretty good write up about Comic-Con. I'll admit I'm not going to offer my thoughts on the things that don't interest me, because well, thats the thing about geekdom. I could defend my most beloved properties from what you said but I'd kind of just be an over the top fanboy.

The Dark Knight didn't have a presence at Comic-Con because it is going to be making an appearance at Wizard World Chicago in a few weeks. I think they did the viral marketing campaign at Comic-Con just to let all the fans know that there was at least something for us here. And the little campaign they put together was actually pretty cool for those who got involved. And I think the move not to show at Comic-Con makes sense. They're going to avoid the rush of geek news that is Comic-Con and will probably be the main attraction at Wizard World.

Now that I have my Dark Knight thoughts out of the way, I can move on to Whedon. Yeah, I'll admit he didn't make the biggest announcments at the con, but come on, he announced Ripper. RIPPER! We get a Joss Whedon TV show and it wasn't worth a mention? I thought it was at least.

Let me say that one more time....RIPPER. Anthony Stewart Head is awesome.

Other than that, thoughts from the con (which I did not attend, as I'm in Australia and I'm not THAT much of a geek), nice Iron Man trailer, I dont know what this movie will be like when it comes out. I'm going against popular opinion and I'll say it might not be all that. We'll see. And that video from the set of Indiana Jones 4 was a pleasant reminder that this movie will be good. Although I kinda wish Spielberg didn't tell us he was making the movie and every shot with what we would like in mind. He did that with War of the World. And we all know how that turned out....

Anyway, just my thoughts. No one need listen to me.

Posted by: Caillan at July 31, 2007 7:52 PM

I hadn't been to CCI in about 10 years, so heading down on Friday was a bit of a shock. Smelly, rude people, long lines, "famous" people charging WAY too much for autographs (I'm looking at you, Ernie Husdon!)... it was just too much for me. I thought I wandered into Movie/TV-Con. Where where the comics? Oh right, shoved off to the left, behind the PotC: AWE display, next to the ABC Family booth and the huge tower of Legos.

I don't mind that events like Comic-Con bring more people to the genre, but has that translated to bigger sales? No. Comics proper are struggling, and the two major events, Infinite Crisis (DC) and Civil War (Marvel), not only failed to increase circulation significantly they also alienated a lot of long-time die hard readers. Namely, me. What was once was a $175 a month habit has dwindled down to 2 series, and where I used to look forward to Wednesdays, I haven't set foot in a shop in months. Maybe it's me, and I've just grown up in the part 10 years, but I just broke my heart to see what was once a hidden gem be turned into a gaudy display.

Posted by: ciji at July 31, 2007 9:06 PM

In regards to the Dark Knight not being at Comic Con, my guess would be that WB made a deal with the city of Chicago and/or Wizard World to only show exclusives at Wizard World Chicago. Since it's being filmed at Chicago I bet that they got a few incentives for doing press exclusively in Chicago. Probably the city was hoping it would help their profile for tourism. Kinda sucks, cause I know of a few thousand people as well as press who were disappointed with no TDK presence at San Diego. I see this as the only reasonable scenario for TDK not being at the Con. Anything else would be and still is a big F U to the fans.

Posted by: ronin at July 31, 2007 9:18 PM

In regards to the Dark Knight not being at Comic Con, my guess would be that WB made a deal with the city of Chicago and/or Wizard World to only show exclusives at Wizard World Chicago. Since it's being filmed at Chicago I bet that they got a few incentives for doing press exclusively in Chicago. Probably the city was hoping it would help their profile for tourism. Kinda sucks, cause I know of a few thousand people as well as press who were disappointed with no TDK presence at San Diego. I see this as the only reasonable scenario for TDK not being at the Con. Anything else would be and still is a big F U to the fans.

Posted by: ronin at July 31, 2007 9:19 PM

Not to get sucked into the Trevor vs Pajiba debate, but can we agree that the Geekdom can be a fickle bunch who can label a comic-based film DOA based on just a clip or leaked 1st draft script? The zealousness is often much appreciated and counted on by Hollywood, that is until they get bit by Aint it Taint News one too many times and decide, fuck it, there aint no pleasin' this group. They then turn to the lowest common demoninator to make money. There seem to be three groups of Geeks: 1. those that get geeked over any little turd 2. those that shit on everything and 3. the middle ground who can be reasonably objective and judge the movie on its merits. Number 3 is most likely the majority, but #2 can be the most vocal.

Posted by: JP at July 31, 2007 10:24 PM

I'm not a big comic fan, and I find it tiresome when uberfans go on about some minutia of their favorite characters. I solve that problem by not reading it. Movie makers can be such whiny little bitches. They love the built-in box office of a comic book-based movie, but then they claim to be sad, so very very sad, when that same base criticizes their focus-grouped masterpiece. My advice to them (and I'd take it as a personal favor, also) is shut the fuck up and cash your paycheck. Nobody's forcing you to make the next Batman movie.

Posted by: LL at July 31, 2007 11:43 PM

haha
i know malin akerman
she lives up the road from me, i didnt have to go to san diego to see her. suckeerrrrsssss

Posted by: MAx at August 1, 2007 1:10 AM

Vermillion,

Shit, you truly are fucking ignorant when it comes to the business/sales side of the comic book industry.

Astonishingly ignorant.

I just love how you pull Wortham and HUAC out of your shitstained ass, as if they have anything to do with today's comic business.

First off, HUAC was NEVER, EVER interested in comic books, as many titles at that time showed superheros bashing the evil commies left and right.

And Wortham?

Shit, that was over 50 fucking years ago, which is eternity in terms of the business cycle of the industry. But I know you just mentioned it to try and show what a true geekoid dweeb you are and how hip and with it you are.

Here's a clue for ya, being "hip" has never and will never equate to being "cool." The two thing s are mutually exclusive, like matter and anti-matter.

Your comments about tradepaperbacks versus single issues are laughable as they again show your complete and utter ignorance of the industry.

Yes, writers and comic book creators are now deliberately writing arcs of stories that fit fairly neatly into 6-7 issues, but that has meant that the spazzoid dorkoid fanboys refuse to vbuy the single issues and instead either illegally download them or wait 6 months for the TP to come out. Either way that translates into millions of $'s in lost revenue and lost sales not just for the comic book companies themselves, but also comic book stores.

And as for Landon's remarks, we have yet more bullshit.

Obviously Landon and Vermillion are Gen Yers who think that they and only they know anything and everyone else is ignorant and wrong and stupid etc. tell me, Landon, when exactly did you stop wearing diapers? I'm going to say, about 5 years ago, which would make you 10 years old, which means you have no basis for your comments.

That he tries to deny that comic book sales are and have been falling for the last 15 years is laughable, kinda like Shrub's continued bleatings that the war in Iraq s going just fine.

And I didn't even touch on the biggest problem in the industry, which is that no young kids, ages 5-12 are reading comics anymore. It's all teenagers and Gen Y'ers like Vermillion and Landon. who in fact are keeping young kids from starting to read comics due to their Landon's bleatings for more tits and ass in comics. Power Girl, anyone?

Comics are dying, end of story.

Posted by: Trevor at August 1, 2007 4:25 PM

Here he is again, calling others idiots and saying we are immature, and yet he can't go a single post without acting like a petulant child.

Listen, buddy, I never said I was always right. Unlike you, I can admit to a mistake. I took issue with you because you came in here wanting to start trouble, slinging your insults for a little attention. I was willing to walk away, and leave it at that.

But since you wish to continue on this route, fine.

1) The man's name is Wertham. With an E. If you are gonna call me an idiot, then at least spell better than me.

2) I am not a Gen-Yer. I am not a Gen-Xer, or Cer. or whatever some sociologist wants to label people he can't understand. I am a adult human being who can talk to other people without resorting to inane insults and pointless labels. How about you?

3) I see you are still obsessed with excrement and anuses. I could say something Freudian about that, but what do I know? I am just an idiot.

4) Saying that Wertham's book does not count because it was 50+ years ago shows your ignorance. The Comics Code was only removed a few years ago, so obviously there was still some effect. Before the Senate hearings (I acknowledge the HUAC mistake, see?), comics were selling by the millions. After people got scared by them, their sales dropped and never reached those highs again. Entire companies failed. Once the Code was created, even more left them behind because they were now dumbed down to be deemed appropriate for kids. It also id not help that television was making it big and supplanting comics as a source of entertainment. They never got back to those numbers.

5) So if the trades are such a losing endeavor, why continue them? Why not just push the individual issues again, since they are so much more lucrative? Why would these publishing companies encourage behavior that is so destructive? Unless, maybe it isn't just fanboys buying them. Just maybe, the people buying those trades are NEW CUSTOMERS, thereby actually adding new revenue.

6) And if comics are dying so, why are they still seen as viable commodities? Why are there more and more titles being launched? Why is there a reality show based on comic book superheroes? Why is it that current pop culture seems to disagree with you? Like I said, they may not be as high as before, but they are certainly not dying.

7) You never did deny that you were doing this because nobody responded to your original post about Kevin Smith. And seeing as how I don't automatically assume you are stupid (a jackass, yes; stupid, no), you would already be aware that Smith has his fans amongst us. So why would you bother? Unless you WANTED someone to prove your little theory and try to debate you, but nobody bit.

Why are you so intent on bashing people about this? Is it really hat important to you? Here, I will stroke your ego a bit.

"Oh great and all-knowledgeable Trevor, your immaturity knows no bounds. I cannot think of a time before I heard your eloquent use of vitriol against people who could give even less of a shit about you. I only wish I could bitch and moan as well as you. I bow to you overpowering aroma nastiness and condescension. If only those stupid fanboys could be as hardheaded and pissed off as you, then you would not have to complain about them so. Way to go, showing them you can be a bigger asshole than they could ever be."

There. That make you feel better?

The thing is, if you had came with a bit more respect, you might have found a bit more support. But coming in, trying to kick people in the nuts, and then expecting everyone to just accept your comments is the pinnacle of arrogance, the very arrogance you complain about. ANd that is the hilarity of the situation: you are proving to be just the foaming-at-the-mouth rabid, antagonistic, prejudicial, asshole fanboy you sought out to denigrate. And you can't even see it because you think you are so different and so unique, just like every other rabid fanboy.

I apologize to everyone here. I got suckered into a dumb flame war with this guy, and co-opted a lot of space for comments that had much more value. I cannot promise it wont happen again, but I will try much better.

And unless he comes up with an insult that doesn't involve my ass or shit or penises or whatever he can come up without his copy of "Truely Tasteless Jokes" (or maybe if he decides to chat like he has an idea of what decorum means), this will be my last response to him. If he wants, he can consider this a retreat. I really don't give a flying squirrel what he wants to tell himself in order to feel a bit bigger in the pants.

But, just to show I can be just as childish but choose not to, at least I don't like Xanadu.

Posted by: Vermillion at August 1, 2007 7:32 PM

Vermillion, don't feed the trolls. It'll just make you angry. :)

Posted by: Bianca Reagan at August 1, 2007 8:33 PM

lol. I love Pajiba.

Posted by: markus at August 1, 2007 8:37 PM

Whoops.

Sorry, Landon, didn't realize that was you with the whole Xanadu thing. My mistake.

And it isn't like I have a sturdy platform to talk crap about other's movie choices anyway.

Posted by: Vermillion at August 1, 2007 8:47 PM

I guess in Vermillion's case, ignorance truly is bliss and you're trying to spread it as far as possible.

I just love how Internet culture has evolved, strike that, I mean devolved to the point where anyone with a contrary opinion to that of the majority is attacked and labeled a troll, even though their argument is unrefutable as mine is.

As far as Kevin Smith goes, I could give a shit that no-one responded to my comments about him. That lack of a response simply proves that once again, I am correct in my assessment of Smith's total lack of directorial and writing skills.

As far as the Comic Code only recently being lifted, stop trying to re-right history to suit your own twisted worldview.

The Comic Code has always been completely voluntary. there was never some board of adults who spent all day doing nothing but reading comic books and giving them either a thumbs up or thumbs down as you claim. The comic book industry was always self governing where the comic code was concerned.

It was Marvel Comics in the early 1970's MORE THEN #) FUCKING YEARS AGO which is hardly recent, who dropped the code from a couple of issues of Spiderman which dealt with drug abuse/drug addiction. It wasn't until the mid 1980's, OVER 20 FUCKING YEARS AGO, again hardly recent, that DC comics took the Comic Code label off a num ber of titles, most notably Swamp Thing ,which at the time was being written by Alan Moore. Towards the tail end of the 1980's, DC launched it's Vertigo/mature readers line, which has never carried the Comic Code , and thus ca n have naked people doing anything and everything, which is what you seem to want for comics like Batman/Superman etc. I suspect you have some sicko fetish for Powergirl, don'tcha?

These days Vertigo continues and in an effort to show that they can be just as outrageous as DC Marvel launched it's MAX imprint which features The Punisher doing the same boring tired played out shit that the character did back when he was first introduced over 30 years ago, except now that it's in the Max line, Frank Castle can say cocksucker/pigfucker/eat shit et all and no one can do dick about it.

And you, Vermillion claim that this is a good thing.

Explain to me how that is going to get a 6 year old to start reading comics?

As for your remarks about trade paperbacks, you still don;t get it, and at this point it's obvious you are too willfully stupid to ever get it, so I'm not going to waste the energy.

Here's the bottom line:

Comic books are dying.

Sales of single issues have been steadily decreasing for over a decade with no sign of increasing.

The introduction of trade paperbacks has only served to increase the the downward sales trend of single issues.

The only reason comic books exist now is not to tell a story, but to serve as a platform for a much bigger source of revenue: merchandising and movie and tv sales.

Posted by: Trevor at August 2, 2007 1:22 PM

Wow - with all the hate here you would think someone went and reviewed a movie made by a black man about a black man in a fat suit and dress.

Posted by: Brian at August 2, 2007 2:22 PM

kevin smith sucks. he's HORRIBLE. "clerks" financed on credit cards? a romantic story. "clerks" itself? a good little indie. everything since? garbage.

Posted by: matt at August 2, 2007 8:50 PM

Some friends and I went to the Con this year as well, and the best part for me was getting to meet George Romero... we even gave him a copy of our own zero-budget zombie flick that we made this past year. I don't even care if he ever watches it, just the fact that he owns a copy of a movie I helped make is every geek's dream.

Posted by: madamz at August 6, 2007 3:01 PM

Hi, I was the "unfortunate" Slave Leia you got a picture with. But I wasn't hired, I just do that for fun. Thanks for being so polite, I appreciated that! It wasn't nearly as bad as you made it sound though, just that one guy was being weird.

Posted by: Sarah at August 19, 2007 10:24 PM





Video ads popping up after each page view? Try clearing your browser's cookies.