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Guides | January 10, 2008 | Comments (111)


Dec. 25, 2007
To: John Williams, Dustin Rowles

Gentlemen —

This has been a good year for movies. Granted, it seems like I find a reason to fool myself into believing that’s the case every year; I look back on what I’ve seen in the past twelve months and tell myself, “Hey, some of those weren’t too bad, and some were actually pretty good.” But there’s something in the air this year, a kind of cautious optimism in the power and fun and terror of movies that takes me back to those halcyon days of the fall of 1999. As of this writing, I’ve seen 54 films released this year — low by some counts, but for a guy doing this in his free time, it could be worse — and I consider 29 of those to have been either partly or completely wonderful, with some of them surpassing the realm of enjoyable entertainment and arriving instead in the place we reserve in our hearts and minds for the films that will matter the most to us in some small way for the rest of our lives.

For me, movies this year were all about heart, and damn anyone who scoffs or rolls their eyes at that, or at me for saying it. I felt more connected to characters this year than I have in a long time. Even in more traditionally popcorn fare like I Am Legend — great idea, good execution, terrible resolution — I was able to almost viscerally relate to the terror of Robert Neville (Will Smith) seeing his dog, his only companion in the blasted wasteland of the future, run into a darkened building.

But I guess I should get on with the big stuff. We’re here to talk about our favorite movies of the year, and maybe the best, if we can come to a consensus (which seems unlikely). I’m loath to make a list and rank the films in question, since they each seemed to offer something unique, making comparisons both impossible and unfair, but I’ll try and share some love for my favorite movies of 2007 without having anybody feel left out.

For starters, Breach and Sunshine were overlooked in the inevitable shuffle. With, Breach, Billy Ray cemented his place as a writer-director who excels at suspense films where the plot is based on a true story and thus already known, or at least available, to the viewer before ever seeing the film. His Shattered Glass was the best thing Hayden Christensen will ever do (as well as a good journalism movie, which is rare), but with Breach he was working with Chris Cooper and Laura Linney. It would be almost impossible to screw up a thriller with that cast, and indeed, Ray doesn’t. And Sunshine was thrilling and disturbing in equal measure. Danny Boyle does hard sci-fi really well, never letting the effects clog the story and always ratcheting up the tension and human drama with every step.

jonesmug.jpgEnough stalling: For my money, the best films of the year were No Country for Old Men, Juno, Lars and the Real Girl, and Knocked Up. (I have been traveling extensively and thus have been unable to see Paul Thomas Anderson’s There Will Be Blood; I reserve the right to add it later if necessary.) I loved several other films this year: the existential Western of The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford; the lush period romance of Atonement; the jaw-dropping whimsy of Stardust; etc., etc., etc. But those four I named up top were the best ones for me this year because they crafted the best characters and did the best job at transporting the viewer into their respective universes. No Country for Old Men is the kind of stirring, gut-wrenching drama that first put the Coen brothers on the map, and watching them revisit their old stomping grounds of Texas and murder was pure joy. And so much has been written about Juno — some of it by me, here on this site — that it’s easy to lose sight of the compelling emotional drama at its center. For all its idiosyncrasies, the film is never less than genuine and true when it comes to handling the relationships at its center, and that’s what makes it a great film.

As for Lars and the Real Girl and Knocked Up, they could almost be two sides of the same worn coin. Lars may be a more easily identifiable outcast, dealing with more nuanced and heartbreaking drama, but his film is shot through with the same loneliness that defines Ben, the hero of Judd Apatow’s meditation on twemtysomethings by way of filthy comedy. They’re both adrift, but despite their best efforts to the contrary, they still wind up growing as men, and as people, finding themselves staring adulthood in the eye and, for the first time, not looking away.

Well, this was longer than I intended. What did you two think of movies this year? Was it good for you? John, I know you and I differed on Into the Wild; feel free to take me to school on that one. And Dustin, what was your 2007? This conversation’s pretty wide open, and we’re just getting started.

Dan

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Dec. 28, 2007
To: Dustin Rowles, Daniel Carlson

Compadres,

I don’t think I made it to 54 movies that were released in 2007, but I certainly made it to more than in recent years (thanks partly to writing for Pajiba), and I agree that it was a strong crop. It doesn’t seem that we’re in danger of losing the steady flow of crap that fuels the site’s “scathing and bitchy” mandate — sequels to adaptations of bad TV shows that should have never been made in the first place, lifeless CGI-fests, the career of Jessica Alba — but those spirit-drainers were joined by a conspicuous number of terrific movies.

Like you, Dan, some of the year-end rush has eluded me. I’m also excited for There Will Be Blood. (I thought Boogie Nights was good but overrated, and I hated Magnolia, but in a culture where most “quirky” projects have all the teeth of the local Starbucks, Punch-Drunk Love was a genuine weird-fest, and I loved it, so Paul Thomas Anderson has built up some credit with me.) I’m not seeing Atonement on principle, because even though the reviews are almost unanimously positive, it’s my favorite contemporary novel, and I just don’t see how the movie could be so good that it’s worth mixing the two experiences.

My own picks for the best of 2007, which I’m afraid are pretty conventional, have only one overlap with Dan’s. I enjoyed Juno more than I could have imagined after the first 20 minutes, which I found incredibly grating, but in a strong year its big, moving finish didn’t quite vault it on to my list. I haven’t seen Lars and the Real Girl, and honestly, Dan’s enthusiasm is the only thing that’s making me question that choice and will be what compels me to rent it. The preview made me laugh in the wrong way, and I just don’t see how everyone involved could possibly pull off that premise without embarrassing themselves. Dan writes that Lars is “staring adulthood in the eye,” but it seems to me that “staring sanity in the eye” would be more accurate. But I respect The Carlson, so I’ll give it a peek someday. (Dustin, did you see it? Thoughts?)

I had a lot of fun at Knocked Up, I just fail to see the depth in Apatow that others in our generation seem eager to find. His movies are pretty funny. I enjoy them. They’re also way too long and have too many painfully improvised moments for my taste. (The 40-Year-Old Virgin could have been cut by a solid 40 minutes, which is insane.)

Where we agree is No Country for Old Men. I thought it was brilliant on just about every level. I have small complaints, some of which would involve spoilers, so I won’t go into them here, but it’s a return to form for the Coens and easily one of the year’s top releases.

ratmug.jpgI had the best time this year at Ratatouille, which I found just as expertly made and paced as most Pixar efforts. But where the studio’s other movies have moments of poignancy — like the lovely scene in Toy Story when Buzz figures out he’s a toy — I thought Ratatouille had a sustained emotional strength. An animated rat wouldn’t have been my first guess for the year’s most sympathetic character, but there it is.

Right behind those two, for me, are Michael Clayton and Before the Devil Knows You’re Dead, which are both shot through with cynicism and misery but are so well made that you leave the theater feeling uplifted. And while it wasn’t perfect, I greatly enjoyed I’m Not There, Todd Haynes’ high-concept tribute to Dylan.

But it’s true that Into the Wild packed the strongest emotional punch for me. I won’t try to change your opinion, Dan. It seems like you’ve thought about it and just came out at a different place than me. I will say that I was unnerved by the chorus of “spoiled brat” in the comments when I reviewed that one. In my experience, spoiled brats get jobs working for their father’s company and/or try to fill the soul-shaped hole inside by buying more and more disposable crap. Christopher McCandless, the subject of Into the Wild, can be described in a bunch of ways — plenty of them critical — but spoiled brat seemed way off the mark to me.

Dustin, I’d be curious to hear your brief take on Sweeney Todd, and not only so you can share some of the heat I’ve gotten for not loving it. Contra many of the assumptions in response to my review, I’m a fan of musicals and have a decent knowledge of them for a 33-year-old heterosexual guy. At least Todd wasn’t the cultural crime that was Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, but isn’t the Burton-Depp Goth-shtick several years past its expiration date?

Best,
John

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Dec. 29, 2007
To: Daniel Carlson, John Williams

Fellas —

John, I think I’m probably of the mind that the Burton-Depp Goth shtick doesn’t have an expiration date; Depp is supernaturally suited for Burton’s style of filmmaking, and I could watch those two work together for another few decades. That said, while I liked Sweeney Todd a bit more than you — the cinematography was beautiful, the blood was gloriously plentiful, and the performances were stellar, despite the weak singing voices — I agreed with your assessment that the lack of plot and character development ultimately doomed the film (the stage production had more of the latter, but the plot is still melodramatically stolid and predictable).

As for both Michael Clayton and Before the Devil Knows You’re Dead, I have to disagree with you on both counts, John (and, to a lesser extent, with Dan’s review of the former). Clayton featured one of the better performances of the year, in George Clooney, but both movies were too cold and detached for my tastes; they were technically proficient, but they lacked likable or interesting characters and there was nothing in either storyline that resonated with me, while Phillip Seymour Hoffman’s performance in Devil was only his third best of the year. I felt similarly about Breach, Dan — like Clayton, it was another unsatisfying thriller improved only by a remarkable performance from Chris Cooper, but not completely saved.

In fact, the Coen brothers schooled both Tony Gilroy and Sidney Lumet in terms of bleak, tension-filled studies in morality. We all three agree that No Country for Old Men was among the top films of the year. The brothers created, in Javier Bardem’s Anton Chigurh, my all-time favorite Coen character, and my favorite scene in any movie this year may have been the simple exchange on the couch between Josh Brolin’s Llewellyn Moss and Kelly MacDonald’s Carla Jean: “Where’d you get the gun?” “At the gettin’ place.” … “You keep running your mouth I’m gonna take you in the back and screw ya.” “Big talk.” It was scenes like that one that elevated No Country above the other bleak thrillers this year, giving us something to emotionally invest in before their grim denouements. I can already tell that this is going to be an unpopular sentiment with both of you, and with our readers, but the thing that kept No Country from among my top three films of the year was the ending. It’s not the actual ending I had a problem with, it’s that it ended there — I was just settling into my theater seat for another half hour of greatness when the bastards jerked those characters away from me. I wasn’t ready. That “leaving you wanting more” feeling can be a great one, or a disappointing one — here, I just found it immensely frustrating. I suspect I may be alone in that respect.

And while I loved both Stardust and the Capraesque Lars and the Real Girl (you really should give it a shot, John — it’s one of those small-town, relationship-focused films I know you love, like You Can Count On Me and Junebug, only there’s a blow-up doll in this one), my top three only differs with Dan by one — I’d replace Lars with Waitress, creating the unwanted-pregnancy trifecta, along with Knocked Up and Juno. Indeed, 2007 was the year of the accidental conception (two were fueled by alcohol, and the other by boredom). Those three films probably resonated a little more with me this year because I saw two of them while my own wife was pregnant (planned), and speaking from that perspective, I’d have to disagree with John’s assessment that Apatow lacks depth. Underneath all the pot and porn jokes, he captured a lot of the nuanced feelings one experiences during pregnancy, though Paul Rudd’s character also struck a chord with me (I would have to agree with a lot of folks, however, in that he gave short shrift to the female perspective). Waitress, on the other hand, successfully captured that overwhelming, change-your-life epiphanic explosion that accompanies childbirth. And while Dan thought that Lars was the other side of the Knocked Up coin, I saw Juno as an alternative version of Knocked Up, where — a decade later — Ben Stone marries an infertile Alison Scott, but never grows up (and props to Diablo Cody for creating a mature, responsible female character who is actually sympathetic, embodied perfectly by Jennifer Garner). Ellen Page was magical in Juno, but I found Jennifer Garner and Jason Bateman’s storyline the more compelling one — when Garner took Bateman to task for still wearing Nirvana T-shirts, I felt tiny.

Overall, I tend to agree with both of you that it was a great year for movies, though the stinkers were just as plentiful as in other years — it was a rough spring, summer, and early fall, and the death of torture porn has been a little too slow for my liking. Before I pass it back to Dan, I’d like to ask how you two felt about some of the movies, besides the ones that you’ve mentioned, that fell outside of awards season — I thought it was a lackluster year for blockbusters, but if there was an Oscar for pure awesome, I’d have to give it to The Bourne Ultimatum, and I also think that Zodiac has been unfairly overlooked. Also, what about this year’s performances? The best all year for me may have been Ryan Gosling in Lars and Phillip Seymour Hoffman in Charlie Wilson’s War. And finally, considering how similar our tastes in movies often run, Dan, I was surprised with how much you liked Atonement. With apologies to both you and John, I thought the movie — like the novel — was no more than a better written version of The Notebook. It didn’t work for me — I thought it was Oscar-grubbing at its finest, this year’s The English Patient or Titanic (minus an hour).

Back to you, Dan.

Dustin









2007 Roundtable: Part Two | Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles













Comments

Hmm, thought I was reading Slate there, for a moment.

Ok, first of all, nothing with Hayden Christensen on it can EVER be classified as good cinema. (It's called the Claire Danes Law of Cinematic Suckage)

Second: "I had a lot of fun at Knocked Up, I just fail to see the depth in Apatow that others in our generation seem eager to find..." this should be the defining quote for the past year folks, there really is nothing there. Those movies will NOT hold up.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 7:29 AM

hmmmm....that was interesting. I felt like I was sitting down to listen to a conversation over coffee. Where's the scathing?! Where's the bitchy?! I don't know what to do! Screw it!

My favorite movie of the year was Norbit.
I loved the way that Eddie Murphy poured his heart and soul into that fat suit to truly experience what it is to be a fat black woman. I mean, of COURSE they are all named Rasputina. Of COURSE they are all controlling and obnoxious. And of COURSE every other phrase out of their mouths is either some combination of 'no' and the word 'baby' or just a long drawn out 'mmmmmmm - hmmmmmmmm'. Where could he go wrong? Then, he just flexed his acting muscle like I flex my sphincter by squeezing out another gem of a performance by playing multiple roles in the movie.

Second best performance of the year goes to Dan Fogler for his spot-on performance of a shit-sucking dickbag. Come Oscar time, MOVE OVER Philip Seymour Hoffman. Get out of the way Ryan Gosling! Wtahc out Daniel Day Lewis! There's another Dan on the block! And he's here to shit all over the golden statue for years to come!

There...now i feel a little better. Time for coffee!

Posted by: PissBoy at January 8, 2008 7:48 AM

We Brits are missing so much. I haven't seen Lars or Waitress or Juno or No Country for Older Men. I highly doubt at least two will be opened in theatres nationwide. My only resort is to get it on dvd or move over to America where I can see these good indie flicks you all argue for. We do have bloody St. Trianians nationwide though.

Knocked up did it for me too this year. Loved it.

Posted by: Jean at January 8, 2008 7:55 AM

Here I thought it was my non-American self not understanding "great American genius" Apatow. The films are funny, but that's about it. I really don't know any people in my everyday life who are like the guys he portrays in his films. I tend to avoid that kind of people because I'm allergic to idiots. And they mostly seem like idiots to me. Maybe I'm missing the point. Oh well...

While my film knowledge has certainly improved since I started reading pajiba, I really can't bring myself to watch some of those films you guys regularly masturbate on. And nothing, I mean NOTHING will make me watch a film with Hoffman, Hanks and Roberts in it. I don't care how many oscars they get or how many AIDS cures they discover, I can't stand those fuckers.

Posted by: joker at January 8, 2008 8:05 AM

I can't believe I'm about to say this but:

You make a very good point BSlim. I got the feeling with the majority of this year's offerings that they weren't even trying to stand the test of time; the directors didn't have a vision, the movies had nothing to say for themselves outside of marketing toys or getting cheap laughs. I know it's the purpose of 99% of movies to make money and it's probably been the same way for the ages but 2007 was the year I officially upgraded to "cinephile" so I'm going to bitch about it now.

That's why it's so good to see movies like Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, No Country for Old Men and There Will be Blood (even The Assassination of Jesse James and Michael Clayton) because they feel like movies of substance, films that are trying to do something as well as make a profit at the box office. The other side of the coin are movies like Waitress and Juno which have real heart (lothe as I am to use that phrase) and will, in my opinion, continue to stand up as long as people still experience gamut of emotions that these films draw their inspiration from. I'm not sure where Knocked Up falls in relation to that, based on where my life lies currently and the course it's taking the main emotion it inspired in me was "sheer, abject horror" but if someone in that situation can draw something from the film, as Dustin did then it may continue to be relevant as subsequent generations of filmwatchers also pass through that stage.

And, while I'm on the rantish subject: what the hell happened to kid's movies? Maybe it's the rosy tint of nostalgia talking but didn't movies marketed specifically to children, or some of them at least, sometimes verge on iconic? Aside from the couple of solid offerings this year (Ratatouille and Enchanted are what sprins to mind) it seems like none of them have even tried to achieve anything other than shilling their overpriced merchandise. I know, I know, it's always been that way blah, blah, blah nostalgiacakes but couldn't studios try a little harder to maybe invest some substance into their offerings? Who says we can't have more than one movie, suitable for children that doesn't cause adults watching to wildly search for sharpened objects with which to blind themselves and serves some small purpose other than to teach children the joy of fucking shopping every year? Oh right, that would be too much effort. Fuckers.

Don't even get me started on fucking fat suits.

Posted by: Alex the Odd at January 8, 2008 8:17 AM

Alex the Odd: If you are worried about the future for kid offerings, Simon Cowell (king of the entertainment as junk food phenomenon) did an interview for the GQ Men of the Year issue in which he states that: to tap the younger market in 5 to 6 years media productions need to copy the Disney/High School Musical/Hannah Montana model. Obviously he's looking to get it on that.

Be afraid, be VERY afraid...

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 8:26 AM

*get in

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 8:27 AM

I was fortunate enough to see Lars and the Real Girl on one of the, like, three days it was in my town. A really wonderful movie experience - one moment I was laughing, the next I was genuinely moved to tears. I still haven't seen most of the others mentioned but definitely want to (I can squeeze a decent movie date out of my boy once in a blue moon, in between scores of crappy movie dates - yes I'm looking at you Transformers).

Posted by: b at January 8, 2008 8:45 AM

With the exceptions of Knocked Up and anything in which Pasty Sanctimonious Hogwash appears, I agree with all y'all. It was a good year for movies, not great, but good.

I congratulate BSlim for identifying CDLCS syndrome (pronounced "kidlicks" for obvious reasons). Surely he is correct in including the pretty vacuity of Hayden Christensen. I would up the b/v ratio of each datum (beauty/vacuity) when formulating the degree of suckitude of AssAlba.

The Coen brothers always find new ways to keep me entertained, even (maybe especially) when returning to their Texas and murder roots (I call it "prairie dust and blood on the rug". Surely a potent combo in their hands.)

I cannot put Knocked Up and Juno on the same coin (even on opposite sides). They are completely different currency. I just do not get Apatow as insightful. He writes sophomoric raunch comedy that is forgotten as soon as it is tossed off. Juno was a tad precious but featured redeeming performances all around. Freakin' Schillenger the Nazi (for his most memorable character) is a highly underappreciated actor and Jennifer Garner fully redeemed herself. She gets a lifetime free pass.

For me, the lead character of Into the Wild is the very definition of spoiled brat. Look at me as I reject the comfortable life my parents bought me and trail into the wilderness (of Alaska and my soul) despite having no knowledge of either. Freezing to death is an earned end for being so righteously and egregiously foolish.

Maybe we are all too old, but each of my siblings got a headache from the overly frenetic camera work in Bourne Ultimatum, despite liking the movie very much.

Posted by: rudy at January 8, 2008 8:50 AM

I love you scathing, bitchy folks-with-taste. Gives me some hope to know that there are folks like yourselves out there.

However, BSlim, I'm alarmed to read your Simon Cowell quote (though you sum the man up so well!). So sad to think that there's an endless market for all this crap. It's the same feeling of dread and hopelessness that I felt when I met an actual, honest-to-goodness Celine Dion fan a few weeks ago...I didn't think they actually existed...well, I suppose I knew there must be some fans out there; she can't exist solely for people's mocking pleasure...I guess I just expected them all to be little old ladies, not gals my age.

Anyhow, way off topic. Sorry.

Count me among the Knocked Up lovers, although I've never been in the family way myself, and although I've merely liked the other Apatow films (holding out hope for Walk Hard, though). Maybe it's the Canadiana, maybe the big dose of heart in it, but it put a big ol' smile on my face. As for other movies mentioned here that I've seen (Ratatouille and Waitress), both were immensely likeable and sweet and poignant, but the characters were more relatable to me and the laughs were more plentiful in Knocked Up.

OK, that's my too-many cents. Sorry to blather!

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 8:55 AM

Still haven't seen or read Into the Wild, but from all I've heard, "spoiled brat" really does sound harsh. (Foolish naif, maybe?) To me, a "brat" is not a person who is trying (misguidedly, yes) to better himself.

I can see the argument that his actions were selfish, but it doesn't sound as if he's being intentionally selfish, and to me that makes a big difference.

Re-hashing an old argument here, I know, but I'm just having a hard time seeing how this poor dumb kid deserved what he got. I just can't help comparing him to other well-known rich kids/celebutards of today, and in my mind, he seems like an awfully likeable, sympathetic character in comparison.

Gad, I should watch the film before running my mouth (er, fingers?) off based on second-hand knowledge. Sorry!

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 9:16 AM

I hadn't really thought of it, but 2007 really was the Year of the Accidentally Yet Comedically Pregnant. I adored Knocked Up, Juno, and Waitress, and all three succeeded in provoking different emotions in me upon leaving the theatre.

In general, I guess I agree most with Dustin's assessment of the year in film. Maybe having a baby this year has brought out his feminine side. Whatever it is, I can relate.

Posted by: Kolby at January 8, 2008 9:28 AM

Thanks Daniel for mentioning Sunshine. While I didn't really like the turn it took towards the end, there are some scenes that haunt me still.

No Country was definitely my favorite this year. The banter back and forth and my origins being from Texas put this movie over the top for me.

Posted by: Lex at January 8, 2008 9:58 AM

Let me also add in some Sunshine love, I watched it just last week after it, somehow, *shifty eyes* ended in my I-pod.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 10:01 AM

Loved Sunshine until the boogeyman showed up. I mean really...did they have to turn it into a cheesy slasher-flick there at the end? And they'd been doing so well. *sigh* Also I liked the physics commentary...go CERN!

Oh and Juno is coming out here in february, according to the local cinema website, but from past experience, they'll probably replace it with something involving Jessica Simpson.

Posted by: joker at January 8, 2008 10:07 AM

Is it just me, or was 2007 the year of dude movies? I've seen a lot of the films bandied about this year, and enjoyed them immensely. But I can't shake the feeling that all those heralded performances and elegant, subtle plotlines tended to focus on very masculine characters, revolving around masculine perspectives. I am happy to hear Juno and Waitress (although - sorry guys - I was severely underwhelmed by the latter) talked about, but everything else up to bat is a western or a heist or something.

I am not accusing 2007, nor its film critics, of ignoring the female and her perspective, or of disrespecting it. There sure were some awesome gals in the Man movies I'm talking about. Just wondering if anyone else felt the same way - I've seen a lot of strong, iconic, but somehow repetitive men in the movies this year.

Posted by: Lyra at January 8, 2008 10:16 AM

Add me to those who didn't love Knocked Up. I can't get past the fact that if this movie hadn't been made by Apatow and hadn't included the adorable Paul Rudd and hadn't had a male lead to whom many Pajiban males can apparently relate, it would have received the same treatment that the horrid P.S. I Love Uou deservedly got on this site. It's an unbelievable plot with a preposterously unrealistic ending and the few really funny moments cannot redeem it from that gutter (unlike 40-Year Old Virgin which had enough hilarious moments to distract). I think the Apatow ensemblre-cred clouded your judgement somewhat.
Maybe it's the barren-wombed cynic in me, but I really hate Hollywood's insistence that "having babies changes everything and makes you a wonderful person". It just doesn't happen that way (see, Spears, Britney). Waitress was at least willing to cover the fact that she really didn't want to be pregnant while Knocked Up could have been a bitter sweet comedy about two people who will never get together happening to procreate by accident but it took the low road.

Posted by: PaddyDog at January 8, 2008 10:54 AM

Oops! That would be "ensemble" above.

Posted by: PaddyDog at January 8, 2008 10:57 AM

Lyra, good point...but has there been a year of the chick movie yet? (and I don't mean "chick flick", rather a year in which movies from a strong female perspective predominated)

There may well have been, it's just not springing to my mind. Bear in mind the coffee hasn't kicked in yet, heehee.

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 10:57 AM

But PaddyDog--from one barren womb to another, did you not find the end of Waitress slightly preposterous? The whole world going into soft focus when the to-then-unwanted spawn is placed on mummy's bosom? I mean, I know hormones are powerful...but THAT much?

Thoughts from anyone who has procreated??

Ye gods, I should be doing work....

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 11:03 AM

But Lyra 2007 was the year that Hollywood as a whole decided that female leads just weren't profitable enough (unless they have a mouth that could fit an 18 wheeler widthways) to carry a movie alone, is it any wonder we only got given dude movies?

I personally liked Knocked Up, it made me giggle a massive amount and has remained as funny on repeated viewings. Granted: it did make me horredously paranoid that I was pregnant for, like eight weeks leading me to spend at least £50 on a variety of home tests - but meh, all in the name of comedy.

Posted by: Alex the Odd at January 8, 2008 11:03 AM

No Alex...please. Start on fat suits. As the son of two parents who are both morbidly obese due to a very serious car accident coupled with years of limited mobility this is a rather sore subject for me and I would love it if someone took it to task. I would do it myself but Hulk mad. Me no like Hulk mad! You know what...fuck it. It's gonna happen i might as well kick the ball to get it rolling. Why not here? Fuck every person who even once in their life has laughed at the concept of an actor in a fat suit as humor. Fuck everyone who has ever gigled at a heavy person. Fuck everyone who tells a fat joke. That's why i hate Jay Leno. At least 1 fat joke per monologue. Fuck him! I have only ever seen 1 movie that even ATTEMPTED to approach the emotions/psyche of people dealing with weight issues...and (I don't believe I'm about to say this...) it was Shallow Hal. While cookie-cutter in it's 'Beauty on the inside approach' at least the heart was in the right fucking place. Sure they used site gags like the underwear or the diving board, but that was just to remind people Jack Black wasn't fucking Gwenyth Paltrow circa 110 lbs. Even the food jokes and his reactions to her weren't THAT bad. I may sound like a bitch but I actually LOVE the ending to that movie cuz you NEVER see the ugly people/fat people/unwanted people end up happy at the end. So hollywood continues to make shit like Norbit, and the Clumps, and Big Momma's House. Fuck them. Fuck Eddie Murphy. Fuck Martin Lawrence. Maybe they should spend some time with a heavy set person at the mall around xmas when suddenly from 50 feet behind them someone yells 'Fatass!!' and you have to see the look on his or her face. Or go to a restaurant and not be able to sit in a booth. Or not be able to go to the fucking movies with them because the seats are tight and it causes pain in the hips. Not every fat person eats greesy food, 14 lbs of cake, and milkshakes every day. Not every heavy person has the 'I don't care what the world thinks...I'm large and in charge...' attitude. Fuck them again! Speak to someone once in a while and listen. 99.999999 percent of them would give ANYTHING and i mean ANYTHING to the lowest common denominator to change their body to something even remotely easier to navigate, something less physically painful, something a little smaller so they can go on a fucking roller coaster. Then, no matter WHY they are heavy, most of them have something preventing them from losing the weight. Medical coverage doesn't cover dietitions for most, a lot of people are too old or have other medical conditions preventing surgery or banding. And dieting???? Fine...10 lbs is a start...but when you get to be a certain size/age your metabloism slows to a crawl. Fuck you Eddie. Fuck you Martin. Fuck you Tyler Perry. Fuck you Mike Myers. Fuck you Alison Hannigan. Fuck you all. I hope you all crash into a fucking gas truck and burn. And hopefully you'll be a little more plump so it'll take a while.

Pardon me for changing the vibe of the comments if I did or getting away from the topic at hand. please continue with normal comments.

Posted by: PissBoy at January 8, 2008 11:15 AM

I liked Knocked Up and I loved Juno. I think that it is possible for having a baby to change a person's life. I don't think it is ridiculous to think that either. Just because there are a lot of negative examples of how having a child can affect a person doesn't mean that there is nothing positive either. I just think it is too bad that women having children is almost equated as always a bad thing now. Or maybe I was misunderstanding some of the comments on here. Its like if a movie ends happily, then it must be trite or unrealistic.

Posted by: Erin at January 8, 2008 11:15 AM

I am curious to know how many people who are unimpressed with Apatow are those who didn't watch freaks & geeks and uneclared. As much as I think his recent works can stand on their own, I sometimes feel like I'm holding onto my love for him because of those shows. Also, I think any indie hipster kid I went to my liberal arts college with could have written Juno.

Posted by: VeinsrHiways at January 8, 2008 11:20 AM

I am curious to know how many people who are unimpressed with Apatow are those who didn't watch freaks & geeks and undeclared. As much as I think his recent works can stand on their own, I sometimes feel like I'm holding onto my love for him because of those shows. Also, I think any indie hipster kid I went to college with could have written Juno.

Posted by: VeinsrHiways at January 8, 2008 11:21 AM

Ahem.

Knocked Up over Waitress?
Knocked Up over Darjeeling Limited?
Knocked Up, over...hell...SUPERBAD? Now THAT was a coming of age movie. Teenage kids dealing with their sexuality, for me, is what the phrase "coming of age" truly means.

Guys in their 20s are OF AGE.

That is all.

Posted by: boo at January 8, 2008 11:22 AM

i both agree and disagree with alot of things here. some one said nothing with hayden christensen in can ever be declared good cinema, this is wrong, straight up.

i dont normally say so strictly that some ones opinion is wrong, in fact i never do, so i apologise but im not even a fan of the kid and i think the rep he's gotten from fuckin star wars is unfair, he cant be expected to be any good in that tripe. watch his work before SW, Life as A House, for example, the boy is talented.

I agree with the Claire Danes law though, as good as Stardust COULD HAVE BEEN, it was NOT as great as the ratings it got, Claire Danes whole existance saw to that.

I mean Baz Lurhmans R+J was fucking amazing in no uncertain terms but even i can cant love it as whole heartedly as i'd like with that dip stick fugging it up all over the place and sucking all over everything.

through out stardust i found her so unavoidably awful that i couldnt agree it as much as i'd like...then again, i found the lead male unlikeable too, they each could have been played by anyone really, niether of them brought anything special to their roles the way say, Dexter Fletcher made the pirate henchman his own by being Dexter fucking Fletcher.

But other wise i...i'm heartbroken to say i havent seen the majority of films released this year, the university i attend is in The Country so our cinema only gets the obvious releases, nothing interesting or anything of the sort.

I had to d/l Gone Baby Gone and even the shitty quality version i could find prooved once again to me what i already knew and have done since To Die For; Casey Affleck is a frighteningly gifted young man.
As for Ben's directing, i alway stood by Ben even through...*shudder* Daredevil, Gigli, all of it.

the guy is talented, always has been, and GBG showed he's gifted behind the camera too.

I'm beginning to fear i may never see The Assassination of Jesse James, it was only released on one cinema in liverpool and by the time i came home fo the holidays from university, got my bearings etc, it was gone again.

This film could well become one of my favourite ever, something i dont usually say about a film until i've seen it, but the cast alone guarantess my fandom; Brad Pitt, Casey Affleck, Jeremy Renner, Sam Rockwell...a collection of intimidating talent make no mistake.

I've yet to see Waitress, and Juno, but i suspect i'll love these too.

i was reluctant to see Little Miss Sunshine when people raved about it, i've always found 'raved' films never live up to their expectations but my sister made me watch it and lo if i wasnt beyond in love with it five minutes in.

Plus i fucking adore Ellen Paige so there's no way i can hate it. she's tiny and sassy and adorable.


but my point is, my cinematic experience this eyar has been sadly lacking but this is something i plan to rememdy asap, if i have to get the train to see my movies.

Posted by: nadine at January 8, 2008 11:29 AM

I have to disagree with Dustin on the ending of No Country. It ended like the book did. Fabulously. I loved how true they were to the book, which so seldom happens in cinema (i.e. what the HELL did they do to the ending of The Golden Compass???? Don't even get me STARTED on I Am Legend. Good movie, but TOTALLY different than the awesome book).

Posted by: TorontoPam at January 8, 2008 11:31 AM

PissBoy: Exfuckingactly. Fatsuits are the modern day blackface and just as offensive. Well said.

And boo, normally I agree with everything that comes from that pretty tattooed persona of yours but guys in their 20s? Of age? Lord, please tell me you're wrong because I know guys in their 20s. I am surrounded by guys in their 20s. Hell, guys in their 20s are my viable dating prospects. If guys in their 20s are even half way to maturity someone sign me up for a life of fag haggery and occasional forays into lesbianism.

Posted by: Alex the Odd at January 8, 2008 11:31 AM

MO: Absolutely, the ending of Waitress was preposterous (from the money point of view), but my point was that until then, she was pretty ambivalent about being pregnant. I do actually think (without personal experience) that the initial hormonal surge after giving birth and seeing the child for the first time is quite powerful so I'll give it a pass on that. The preposterous part for me was the money.

Erin: Where on earth do you live where "women having children is almost always equated as a bad thing"? Because, everywhere I look all I see are magazines keeping "baby bump" vigils and oohing over celebrity babies. Actually, I think one of the People type mags ran a headline last year on how "pregnancy is the new black". Here in the real world, everyone I know is delighted at the news of a pregnancy of a friend or colleague.

Posted by: PaddyDog at January 8, 2008 11:32 AM

I agree with Erin. How come having a baby has to be the horrible, life-ruining, utter devastation of a person? Could it be that...gasp...some people actually like their own babies? Even so far as to, say, give birth to them without a bunch of whining about how their lives were ruined?

Couldn't it be "realistic" that a woman is shown to actually feel some sort of happiness when that new life is placed in her arms? Or that some people can actually change from bitter husks of existence to emotional human beings? I mean, Dustin is proof positive of the latter (no offense).

Posted by: Vermillion at January 8, 2008 11:33 AM

the one thing on all of this i flat out refuse to see is Knocked Up.

Im not going to say its shit without seeing it,i cant possibly know, but Skank Cancer is unwatchable in every incarnation and as funny as Apatow was in 40 year old virgin, i dont see in him any kind of leading man type of character.

im sure its a very funny movie, i just cant stand Heigl, her face, her hai, her teeth,her whole persona, she cant act and i've yet to figure out how she won that award that she won...what was it again?

either way she blows monkey testicles.

Posted by: nadine at January 8, 2008 11:35 AM

Hmmm, the "unwanted-pregnancy trifecta"...I loved each of those movies. Even though they were distinct from one another, they all made me feel the same way: glow-y, warm, mushy, you know...that kind of feeling. On that note, I can't understand classifying Apatow films as mere gross-out humor. I guess Knocked Up had a touch of that, but I thought it also had a great deal more depth than most comedies. I cared more about the characters than I expected to, and in the end, despite some vulgarity, it was incredibly sweet and endearing.

And I have to say that I like the "pregnancy changes things" theme. A lot of my friends are new moms, and from what I can tell, perspectives change, and often for the better. Now granted, sometimes someone is too self-absorbed (or certifiably insane?) to appreciate the new perspective (e.g., Spears, Britney), and I realize that many women aren't to a place in life where it is appropriate for them to have a child (financially, emotionally, what-have-you) but I can't help but believe that becoming so quickly and deeply invested in aother person's well-being - so deeply that concern for yourself becomes almost secondary - is good for a person. I think one of the greatest challenges in life is getting past yourself and understanding the opinions, perspectives, and needs of others - - and wouldn't bringing a child into the world get you closer to being able to do just that? Not that women should just go and pop one out to reach some sort of understanding of the universe or something. I'm just saying I get the theme.

However, back to the list...I think my absolute favorite movie of the year was Stardust. I'm a sucker for fairy tales and fantasy, and it has been way too long since I've seen this kind of film. It made me forget about everything for a few hours and was sweet, romantic, fun, and lovely to watch. I also think Zodiac hasn't been given due credit.

And finally, I have to take issue with the inclusion of Breach on this list. Not that I disliked it, but I thought it was a mite dry and moved too slowly - in my opinion, it doesn't equal the other films discussed above.

Posted by: tt_marie at January 8, 2008 11:39 AM

Was I the ONLY one who thought that Superbad was the superior film to Knocked Up?

I thought Superbad captured friendship between two people (well OK, guys) in a really honest way - something's that really rare in movies. Right now, Shawshank is the only other one I can think of off the top of my head that in a totally different way gets to the true heart of friendship.

Knocked Up, on the other hand, felt like Apatow saying "All right, this sounds like a funny conversation. You guys do it again but I'll film it this time." And that repeated 20 times or so, over what felt like 3 hours.

Posted by: Siddhartha at January 8, 2008 11:39 AM

Now see here, Miss ODD.

Heh. Did that sound like your mum? Kinda? No? A little? No.

Yeah, I have to say that maturity is certainly lacking in most of the men I know, regardless of age. (Some of them just come equipped with the Immaturity Cloaking Device, others not.)

But I refuse to give anyone more of an excuse to act like an ass than they need. Dammit, I have standards! Yeah, I know, it's hopeless. But I haven't quite given up...yet.

Oh, and I have the Fag Hags and Vag Tags membership papers on hand, so let me know if you need copies...

Posted by: boo at January 8, 2008 11:42 AM

[quote] Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, which are both shot through with cynicism and misery but are so well made that you leave the theater feeling uplifted[/quote]

You have got to be kidding me. The two people I was with and myself all fought over the first sharp object we could find in the parking lot to try and off ourselves after seeing that movie. I still don't think I have my seratonin back. Technically proficient, yes, but what was the point?

And where is the Superbad love? One movie this year made me actually laugh inside the theatre - comedies always get a short shrift.

Posted by: Farfalina at January 8, 2008 11:43 AM

No, Siddhartha, you are not alone! I stand with you!

Posted by: boo at January 8, 2008 11:45 AM

Over many years of movie watching I have come to accept that I like what I like & I'm OK with the fact that there are many folks who don't just disagree with me, but judge me according to those likes. Regardless, I own up to my enjoyment of 2007 movies such as Transformers, Resident Evil 3, Live Free or Die Hard & AvP 2. Whatever. I'm easily entertained. Judge away. That being said, with regard to the movies listed above, my favorite has to be No Country. I was riveted throughout. I also just loved the exchange on the couch as well as the coversation between Woody & Javier in the hotel room. I haven't seen all of the others listed. I really, really enjoyed Juno, especially the relationship between Bateman & Garner. I thought Knocked Up was great fun, but wouldn't qualify it as one of the best movies of the year. I can't bring myself to see Into the Wild since I ended up really hating the main character after reading the book. The one movie not listed that I would have to rank among my favorites is 3:10 to Yuma. I know it's a remake, but I just loved it. I was invested in the outcome and I thought the acting was fantastic. Huh, well, my two cents ended up being more like 5 cents, but there you go.

Posted by: Smello at January 8, 2008 11:48 AM

Hayden Christensen in Star Wras Trilogy:"... he cant be expected to be any good in that tripe. watch his work before SW, Life as A House, for example, the boy is talented...."

I respectfully submit that, the mark of a good actor is precisely that: Being able to rise above the material, hell Harrison Ford was the best thing to come out of the whole "SW saga" (although admittedly he's been coasting along for more than a decade), then you had Alec Guiness, who was phoning it in who SOLD IT, Carrie Fisher SOLD IT, Ian McDiarmid SOLD IT, Liam Neeson SOLD IT, Ewan McGregor SOLD IT. And make no mistake folks except for Empire, they all had HORRIBLE dialogue and character development, but they were so in their game that they made that shit work.
Sorry but Hayden goes on the Jake Lloyd pile. He's a WB/CW quality pretty boy, any underwear model could have stood there, like a jackass, and read the lines, which is what he did. I have lived to regret the times I bad-mouthed DiCaprio when I read that HE was being considered to play Anakin Skywalker, 'Cause you know what? He would have sold it.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 11:52 AM

Re: Hayden Christensen - "He's a WB/CW quality pretty boy" - AGREED. I think he's very pretty and for that reason, I don't mind watching him, but holy shit! He doesn't do anything but stand there woodenly and try to look tough.

Posted by: tt_marie at January 8, 2008 11:57 AM

Pissboy, Alex the Odd: Thank you! Feministing.com posted a link about the whole weight issue the other day, and it's good to know that there are more people who are as outright offended by "fat movies" as I am.

I'd have to say my favorite movie of the year is definitely Juno, even though I only saw it on Sunday. It was sweet and not gratingly quirky. Except for the opening titles, which made me cringe to no end.

Posted by: KatyBelle at January 8, 2008 12:01 PM

I am definitely hoppin' on the Superbad train. I would watch it over Knocked Up any day. Stardust is the only movie I have ever described as Princess Bride-esque and that means it did something right. Also, I didn't realize their was so much hatred towards Claire Danes. I suppose I'm just too nostalgic and will always love her for being Angela Chase describing Jordan Catalano and the way he leans, sigh.

Posted by: VeinsRHiways at January 8, 2008 12:01 PM

VeinsRHiways - you aren't alone. I will always have a place in my heart for Angela. Therefore, I harbor no ill will towards the Danes-inator - I find her sort of cute whenever she plays the wide-eyed innocent (e.g., Stardust, Romeo and Juliet).

Posted by: tt_marie at January 8, 2008 12:07 PM

*applauds* Paddydog, that was a great rant.

Posted by: roses at January 8, 2008 12:13 PM

Hey PissBoy, Alex the Odd, and KatyBelle, I am right there with you on fat jokes/movies. I have to confess, however, that it has come from bitter experience.

In my youth, I was one of those people who could eat and drink any amount of anything and would not gain weight. Hell, my drink of choice was White Russians with Vodka, Kahlua, and Cream. I weighed no more than 120 pounds and could not buy clothes off the rack because I had a 44 inch chest with 36 inch sleeves and a 27 inch waist with 38 inch inseam. I used to (thankfully only internally) deride overweight people for what I perceived to be their simple failure to move. I joked with fellow dancers about marketing "Envy Jeans" where the tag line would be: "If you don't have the body, you don't get our jeans".

But damn Karma is a bitch. I turned forty gained forty pounds and became diabetic. Try as I do, I cannot lose any weight. Previously, I could drop five pounds in a week by simply skipping lunch. Now, I can "eat" nothing but protein shakes and lose only a single pound.

I recently celebrated "victory" by managing to get into my "incentive jeans" by Dolce and Gabanna, which unfortunately are no where near my old waist size. This was accomplished only after denying myself all holiday goodies, including beloved empanaditas and tamales made by my aunts.

I am not sure it was worth it. I embarrassed myself (but fortunately only myself) when I was shopping recently and caught a glimpse of someone. I thought to myself: "If he got a decent haircut and lost thirty pounds he could be good looking". It was only then that I realized that I had seen my reflection in a store window.

Posted by: rudy at January 8, 2008 12:18 PM

Ahem, it seems I didn't make my point clear on Knocked Up. I am not Lady Macbeth. I have no problem believing that that the blonde chick loved her baby. I have a problem believing that a blonde Hollywood type who works as an entertainment reporter for a magazine show would actually try to cultivate a relationship with an unemployed, bong-head simply because he happened to impregnate her one drunken night. She would have distanced herself ASAP and made every effort to ensure that if he ever realized he had a chance of being the sperm donor, she had a cover story to make sure he didn't sue her for some of that cash she was raking in as on-screen talent.
Note: I didn't comment on the differences between them physically because to each his own.
I could, however, have got past all of that if the film had been entertaining enough to make me suspend disbelief (after all, I'm a sci-fi fan, I choose to believe a 40-year old man and a Chav can travel happily around the universe in a phone box), but it just wasn't.

Posted by: PaddyDog at January 8, 2008 12:20 PM

I love you, PissBoy!!!

(ahem, there's something I never thought I'd say...interesting handle, dude!)

I have many relatives with pretty severe weight problems, and it's hard not to take stuff like that personally. It's sad, and angering, that making fun of people's weight is still socially acceptable, let alone f-ing profitable.

I'd refused to watch Shallow Hal because the commercials made it look so mean-spirited (though I really like JB). After reading PissBoy's take on it, I think I'll give it a go.

Now, what was I saying earlier about having to go do some work? (sigh)

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 12:26 PM

"...She would have distanced herself ASAP and made every effort to ensure that if he ever realized he had a chance of being the sperm donor, she had a cover story to make sure he didn't sue her for some of that cash she was raking in as on-screen talent..."

I have the feeling this would be true 99.9999% of the time, and that's ASSUMING, they'd even hook up in the first place. The professional, career oriented women, I know,... I...couldn't even THINK of a situation where that kind of loser would be in the same room with them.
Keep in mind these is not even a Revenge of the Nerd/Geek type situation, this is more a slacker/ unemployed/stoner/loser FAN TA SY.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 12:29 PM

Although I prefer Superbad over Knocked Up, I will still defend the latter... I think it was a good movie because it showed that career driven female ignoring all the materialistic expectations and giving the "slacker" a chance. In reality, those kind of odd matches can sometimes be the best things to happen for both people. Give the stoners a chance, they're less likely to drunkenly shake the baby!

Posted by: VeinsRHiways at January 8, 2008 12:46 PM

I'd refused to watch Shallow Hal because the commercials made it look so mean-spirited (though I really like JB). After reading PissBoy's take on it, I think I'll give it a go.

Just a warning, there are quite a few cheap fat jokes. But (in my opinion) it redeems itself at the end.

Posted by: roses at January 8, 2008 12:46 PM

Thanks BSlim: you are the voice of reason (and you managed it without a Walmart insult, it must be a new year).

By the way, has anyone heard from Socalled lately? He seems to be eerily missing from Pajiba 2008.

Posted by: PaddyDog at January 8, 2008 12:47 PM

Thanks for the warning, Roses! Cheers.

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 12:51 PM

"Give the stoners a chance, they're less likely to drunkenly shake the baby!"

Jeebus, VeinsRHiways, you almost made me spit coffee! Too funny...too true....

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 12:54 PM

It's fascinating to me that all of a sudden, people are maligning the relationship in Knocked Up because Katherine Heigl's character is so career-minded and because Seth Rogen's a "stoner" now, when recently, it was because someone who looked like her would never be with someone who looked like him. Enter one eloquent rant by PissBoy and suddenly, it's a whole new world.

Manny and I took shit for being callous about Biggest Loser. It's true, I was being facetious when I said they should combine it with American Gladiators (which in retrospect might actually make the competition better, but that's a different rant), but I was partially serious. Biggest Loser is no less exploitative than any of the reality TV shows.

Judd Apatow's got some doughy pals. So what does he do? He writes movies where he sets up those chunky dudes as the heroes. Where they get the girls. Where they get the funniest lines. It creates a world where Jack Black can be considered sexy. I rock the holy trinity: I'm short, I'm fat, and I'm bald. And as much as I take pride in being a baby Devito, people still point and laugh and it hurts. I can't change who I am. I can't change stupid people. Not the way I want to. Not without jail time.

Norbit and Fat Bastard and all the other countless names that get thrown around by stupid people, these movies appeal to the lowest common denominator. You know, the same braintrusts that shout things like "Fatass!" in a crowded mall from the safety of great distances. You can't change stupid people, except with pop culture.

It was on this site that I heard a brilliant suggestion. Someone wondered why they haven't written a movie about a fat GIRL's experiences in a "coming of age". The only thing I ever read was called She's Come Undone, and it made it sound like the only choice in life for a fat girl is to pull a Martha Dumptruck ala Heathers. And I didn't think that was fair. So I started working on it. Yeah, I'm a fat dude, who went through high school being a fat short kid, but I'm at least going to try.

You people are smart. You're creative. You're bitchy. Or you've got friends that are. Write your own damn story. Tell it. Or, you know, gather up those geniuses who could EASILY write Juno (because apparently, they're just lounding around film schools these days), and get them to write it for you.

Art can be used as a weapon. So fucking man up and start using it, people.

Posted by: insertclevernamehere at January 8, 2008 12:55 PM

I have to agree with TorontoPam, I thought the ending to No Country was exactly what it should have been. The movies that stay with me are those that leave me unable to lift my feet from the theater floor, sticky substances aside. I couldn't believe it was over, I wanted so much more closure and so many more hours with those characters, but it was fitting that instead I was left with cinematic blue balls.

And I agree with Dustin, any word of another Burton-Depp collaboration will always invoke a mini orgasm.

Posted by: Julie at January 8, 2008 12:59 PM

"...Katherine Heigl's character is so career-minded and because Seth Rogen's a "stoner" now, when recently, it was because someone who looked like her would never be with someone who looked like him..."

Well at least, as far as I'm concerned, *looks* played no part in my take on Knocked-Up, experience did. I married a professional, career oriented woman, and I've had many a chance to relate to her friends, going as far back as when we were in College and had to be around her sorority pals.
Let me tell you, those gals WILL NOT give the time of day to some of these Apatow "types," and that's just the way it is. It's not so much looking like a Calvin Klein model as is about pulling your goddammned weight when it comes time to start paying the bills. Playing X-Box 24/7 is just not gonna cut it son.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 1:13 PM

"The only thing I ever read was called She's Come Undone, and it made it sound like the only choice in life for a fat girl is to pull a Martha Dumptruck ala Heathers."

Oh my fucking GOD, InsertCNH, that is exactly what I felt about that book. HATE.

Regarding Knocked Up, I thought that it was sweet and pretty hilarious, but my problem with it was never the Seth Rogan

Posted by: Julie at January 8, 2008 1:14 PM

I only got partway through your article before scrolling down to the comments. Wanna know why? Because you have two--TWO!--scary clown ads. One on either side. Fuck you, scary clowns.

Posted by: Cuno at January 8, 2008 1:14 PM

Thanks MO. Expect more where that came from...I've been reading this site for too long now without commenting. My resolution for 2008 is to start procrastinating in more productive ways. This is way less pathetic than tetris and tron I hope.

Posted by: VeinsRHiways at January 8, 2008 1:16 PM

Heh, my post didn't post:

"The only thing I ever read was called She's Come Undone, and it made it sound like the only choice in life for a fat girl is to pull a Martha Dumptruck ala Heathers."

Oh my fucking GOD, InsertCNH, that is exactly what I felt about that book. HATE.

Regarding Knocked Up, I thought that it was sweet and pretty hilarious, but my problem with it was never the Seth Rogan/K Heigel hotness discrepancy. For one, I find him incredibly attractive: he has a sweet face, a badass Jew-fro, and he's fucking hysterical. Doughy be damned, I'm no supermodel, and he shouldn't have to be either-I wouldn't kick him out of bed for...eating babies. My issue was that it just too...optimistic for me. Maybe I'm just a cynical ass, but the idea that someone would try to create a relationship from a one-night stand is a bit of a stretch. I still really enjoyed the film though, I don't need everything I watch to accurately mimic life.

Posted by: Julie at January 8, 2008 1:16 PM

My Top 5:

1. No Country for Old Men - it's on another level of filmmaking. Sad, disturbing, and yet with a sense of honesty. I'll never think there's a real Jigsaw killer out there. But a real Anton Chigurh?

2. Ratatouille - While Shrek, surfing penguins and a Jerry Seinfeld-bee all went for the lowest common denominator, Brad Bird goes and makes a love note to the culinary arts. Great.

3. The Bourne Ultimatum - I love action movies. And this is a smart action movie. Most importantly, from the moment it starts till it ends, it just does not stop.

4. Hot Fuzz - OK, I liked Knocked Up and loved Superbad, but this was my favorite comedy of the year. It's just awesome. Simon Pegg's Nick Angel is so far away from his Shaun.

5. Stardust - My list ok. And while there may have been "better" movies, few have the heart and the joy of this little fairy tale. Everyone seems to be having a blast and it's infectious.

Posted by: Fredo at January 8, 2008 1:16 PM

I'm happy to see you mention Breach and Sunshine, Daniel. Both made my unappreciated gems list.

But I'm firmly in the "Knocked Up? Really? Her?" camp.

Posted by: Ashers at January 8, 2008 1:33 PM

AtO's "fat suits are the new black face" comment really hit me - It's so true. I have family and friends who are quite overweight, and I can't imagine them ever laughing at that kind of thing. Those movies are plain despicable. Going back to the movies of the year though - Although completely different in tone/etc from those previously mentioned, what about Grindhouse? It kicked my ass for sure!

Posted by: b at January 8, 2008 1:39 PM

I have actual, concrete proof that sometimes successful, career driven ladies go for the slackasses. MY SISTER. The girl is gorgeous and incredibly smart and driven, but always seems to date the biggest losers. Genuinely nice guys, but really lazy and unmotivated. It's always fascinated me, because she's in a male-dominated profession and therefore has access to a lot of impressive and successful fellas. I used to always nag her about it, but then it hit me: she NEEDS a Seth Rogan type in her life. She's so uptight and focused that she needs someone who will calm her down and make her laugh. There's something to be said for that, I think. If she dated someone with a personality like hers, they'd probably kill each other.

Posted by: tt_marie at January 8, 2008 1:45 PM

I'm glad to finally see some Superbad love flowing!

And for those people who find it hard to believe that Skank Cancer would go for someone who either looks like Seth Rogen or lives life the way that Ben Stone does, I heartily disagree.

A lot of people I know have wives/girlfriends that are way hotter than they "deserve" (including me!). Mostly, I think, because some are talented writers, some are talented comics, and some are just really really smart. I mean look at Judd Apatow himself and his wife. He looks like a cross between a werewolf and Neil from Freaks and Geeks and his wife is ass-tearing-up worthy according to Daryl from the Office. I feel that women are less superficial that way.

I bet a large majority of you know more hot girl/shlubby guy couples than hot guy/homely chick couples.

As for the career thing, at least Ben was an aspiring entrepreneur (albeit in the nudity on film world). Heigl's character was an entertainment reporter. On E!, for christ sakes. That's like one step up from giving handjobs behind Dunkin' Donuts for $5 a pop.

Posted by: Siddhartha at January 8, 2008 1:49 PM

No Country, Gone Baby Gone and Hot Fuzz were my faves this year.

And I have to say that the most unique experience I've ever had in a movie theater happened during the three times I saw Grindhouse. I'm not saying it deserves to be in the top ten, although it would be on my list.

Each time the theater was 3/4 full. At the end where Kurt Russell gets his ass handed too him, all three times there was thunderous applause and cheering from the audience. I've been going to movies for almost 30 years and I've never seen anything like it.

To all you Q haterz out there - before you get that Travis Bickle look in your eye, I was just commenting on what happened in the theater at the end of the movie. I didn't say it should be on the top ten list.

Posted by: bucslim at January 8, 2008 1:49 PM

I hated Shallow Hal. Hate hate hate. It had good intentions, but there were way too many fat jokes in the movie for me to give it any credit. Plus, ugh, Gwyneth Paltrow in a fat suit?? Are you KIDDING me? I left that movie basically hating the universe.

I just wish that we'd see more thin/fat pairings on tv/film where the thinner person (not like Jack Black is thin, but comparatively...) actually, you know, finds the larger person attractive. If a larger person ever has a romantic interest on film, it's always the case that they have an amazing personality, so the other party loves them DESPITE their appearance. Or, in Shallow Hal, he literally has to get duped into falling in love with her.

I know plenty of thin, pretty women who prefer some extra pounds on their men, and plenty of thinner guys who like curvy women, not loving them despite their appearance but actually finding them attractive. (I realize I'm being completely heteronormative right now but you get my point). And I'm not talking about the World According to Jim phenomena where someone thin, beautiful and smart is paired with a misogynistic, lazy schlub. There is a big difference between a normal, overweight guy and a schlub.

I also wish there were more overweight characters (especially women) on film whose main issue was not their weight. This is coming from the perspective of a chubbier (not obese) girl... I don't constantly think about my weight. In fact I don't really think about it at all. And I've never in my life been on a diet. I am not unhealthy. I eat like a normal person. Sure, I could eat salads all the time and be 30 pounds lighter, but I don't want to. Not because I'm lazy, either. In fact, if I could eat and live exactly the way I am now, and still be 30 pounds lighter, I would probably choose my body as it is now. I actually like my curves, and not in the I-don't-want-to-hate-myself-so-I-will-convince-myself-I-am-attractive way either (which is how most people view anyone who is fat-positive). Also, I get asked on dates by thin guys, muscular guys, and larger men, who all find me attractive (not JUST because of my personality, which I should hope is also pretty awesome). Why is that so hard for the rest of the world to believe?

The ONLY fat character on film I've ever been able to identify with is America Ferrera in Real Women Have Curves. While her weight WAS the central issue in the film, it wasn't HER issue, it was the issue of the people around her. She didn't care. Also, a thin and cute boy thought she was beautiful and pursued her! Such an great movie.

This is completely off-topic from the original post, but whatever. /End tangent.

Posted by: Stephanie at January 8, 2008 2:23 PM

Laws, there's so much going in this thread that I don't know where to even start. I've got limited commenting time because I'm generally on here during my son's afternoon nap. So here goes:

insertclevernamehere: You are my new blush. Finally someone else who thought "She's Come Undone" was a big bunch of steaming over-hyped shite.

And I can tell you the reason why there are very few Fat Girl stories out there (Save for "Real Women Have Curves") is that for the most part in American mainstream culture fat girls are non-entities. Fat girls are simply skinny girls waiting to come bursting forth, so the only stories that seem to get told are those transformation tales of a fat homely chick into a skinny hot chick. In most movies or television shows or novels fat girls are either the brassy best friend or the butt of everyone's jokes.

And bizarrely American women buy into this bullshit, as if we have all internalized this notion that a woman isn't worth two cents unless she's physically appealing. It's a subject that has more to it than I have time to babble on about in a comment thread. And I'm speaking as a woman who was a tall fat kid and then a tall fat teenager and a tall fat young woman. I've spent most of my life having to overcome the fact that whenever I walked into a room full of people, I turned invisible.

Finally, on the "fat people are funny" front: While fat bashing seems to be the last acceptable prejudice, it's nothing new. The corpulent funny character is a long tradition in Western culture; Falstaff anyone?

As for the whole pregnancy/childbirth/motherhood discussion: Having recently been through gestation and popping out of my own spawn, I have to say I've been really interested in the spate of movies that take on parenting (Even "Gone Baby Gone" was partly a meditation on what it means to be a good parent.). Despite its aforementioned faults, I enjoyed "Knocked Up" because so much of the pregnancy and childrearing bits were true. I about peed in my pants and severely embarrassed my friend with my cackling during the pregnancy sex scenes. I think the whole hot career woman/schlub stoner conceit of the union was the channel through which Apatow voiced his rather pointed observations on how parenthood changes both men and women.

Sure, there were elements to "Waitress" that were a little fantastical and whimsical, but to me that was part of the movie's charm. Yes, I find it completely believable to have an epiphany when your newborn child is placed in your arms. It's not that difficult to be ambivalent about a parasite growing in your belly (unless you get one of those nifty 3-D ultrasound).

Shit, my husband and I called our son "Lumpy" when he was in utero. We planned to have a kid, but still there were times when it I felt like I had the frelling Alien spawn living in my body, ready to burst forth in a spray of blood during lunch at Chipotle.

But after the initial shock of labor wore off and I got used to his deafening shrieks, the feeling in my arms of this little human being that I nurtured in my body and brought into the world with a lot of pain and really narsty body fluids was indescribable and completely shattered my heart.

On the other hand, this whole motherhood business sure as shit isn't a cake walk. Even the women I know who are excited about the prospect of having children can't deny the fact that so much of your adult life is turned inside out for this little person. And no, that's not whining. Parenthood isn't a bunch of Hallmark moments of warm gushiness, but lots of screaming, vomit, sleepless ness, poopy diapers, and very little free time.

Yet when my kid looks at me and yells, "Big hug!" and throws his little arms around me, I realize that yeah, it's worth it. Pretty much. Mostly.

Posted by: Alabamapink at January 8, 2008 2:30 PM

*takes a moment to look up heteronormative ...

Carry on.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 2:31 PM

alabama pink, that was fantastic. thank you thank you thank you.

i agree on all counts of the invisible fat woman, and the idea that yes, as soon as the little creature is placed in your arms, your attitude can completely change.

but what do i know, i'm just a test tube baby.

Posted by: boo at January 8, 2008 2:46 PM

3:10 to Yuma? No love? Seriously?

I hated Juno. Twee twee twee twee twee. Twee.

Also, I'mma gonna point out a little study that's been done on why really attractive women tend to hookup with less attractive guys- and it actually shows that women aren't so different than men. Dought guys are percieved as more feminine, and therefor more loyal (less likely to stray because he can't do any better). That's why chicks rarely chase the George Clooney's- he can have any woman he wanted, so why would he be faithful to her? Again, just a study that was done- nothing conclusive either way. But I've noticed the trend of hot chick/ugly dude, and not all of those guys are funny or smart.

Posted by: Jon at January 8, 2008 2:53 PM

Ha, ha. In college, I played Falstaff in our stage production of Chimes at Midnight.

My tastes run towards indie, so my top five were Juno, Lars and the Real Girl, Ratatouille, No Country for Old Men, and Once. Because I'm a violent, neurotic fourteen year old girl.

Posted by: insertclevernamehere at January 8, 2008 3:03 PM

It was on this site that I heard a brilliant suggestion. Someone wondered why they haven't written a movie about a fat GIRL's experiences in a "coming of age". The only thing I ever read was called She's Come Undone, and it made it sound like the only choice in life for a fat girl is to pull a Martha Dumptruck ala Heathers. And I didn't think that was fair. So I started working on it. Yeah, I'm a fat dude, who went through high school being a fat short kid, but I'm at least going to try.

What about Real Women Have Curves? I thought that was a touching movie.

I have to agree with Pissboy...I've never been able to see why it was funny to make fun of someone because of their weight. I know I'm not exactly streamlined myself, but you know what? I'm realistically shaped, and I think what's inside matters far more than what's outside. And there are too many people who feel otherwise. It's become a model-thin world...people are being told that skinny is the new cool, and anybody who isn't a beanpole is deserving of ridicule. Fuck that.

I have yet to see all the movies mentioned, but of the ones I did see (Stardust, Juno, Sweeney Todd among them), I highly enjoyed. I hope to be able to see everything else soon....every movie that's looked interesting gets so much love here.

Posted by: Shadows of Dakaron at January 8, 2008 3:18 PM

Thanks, Alabamapink, for shedding the light on my Waitress "is it or ain't it a believable reaction" question. I know the movie was meant to be whimsical, and of course the soft-focus fuzzy wuzzies whem mommy beholds her baby were a bit exaggerated, but it's cool to know that there is a grain of truth there.

Posted by: MO at January 8, 2008 3:36 PM

By the way, has anyone heard from Socalled lately? He seems to be eerily missing from Pajiba 2008.

Hi Paddy; just working on stuff and traveling, and there's been so much new content this week I can barely keep up with the reading.

I'm surprised how far down the thread I had to go to find mention of Gone Baby Gone and 3:10 to Yuma; GBG was easily the best new film I saw this year, even better than No Country. I'm in Dustin's camp, the ending of NCFOM left me cold. I enjoy dark endings, I enjoy ambiguous endings, but I just thought that one didn't accomplish anything.

I guess my big theme with 2007 film is that every year the studios hold the good stuff back later and later for awards purposes, and 2007 was just the worst; most of the films mentioned here were released very late in the year, and as a result I haven't seen many of them. We just don't get to the theatre more than once or twice per month -- I'm a psychotic recluse and prefer to watch DVDs at home.

Re Knocked Up: Going back to the theme of the original comment thread for that film, keep in mind that the situation was a construct for jokes and shenanigans; I don't think Apatow meant it as a template for what he thinks happens in real life, it was just one possible outcome that lent itself to the funny.

Posted by: socalledonlycousins at January 8, 2008 3:43 PM

I say this with absolute honesty 'bama; it's reading the accounts of people such as your fine self and realising that you don't have to immediately lose your soul/identity/sense of fun/80% of your brain power the second you pop out a sproglet and that you can view said sproglet in an objective and mature way (and perhaps that sometimes you may, as much as you love it, desire to throw something at the sproglet's head) that makes me almost consider reproducing as a good thing.

Who knows, by the time I hit 30 maybe I'll almost be amenable to the idea.

Posted by: Alex the Odd at January 8, 2008 3:44 PM

I'm so glad to know that I'm not the only one who fails to see the depth in Apatow's movies. His movies definately have more thought than Ben Stiller's, but I wouldn't say they were deep by any means. I appreciate that he made pregnancy funny and that he made it something that BOTH parents should be a part of, but all that movie did is paint a bleak picture for women. Not only do we have to be strong, smart, attractive and successful career women, we also have to be perfect mothers to our children and mother our babydaddy at the same time? Really Apatow? Ben sat down, read a book (which he should have read when Allison first spoon fed him the responsibility of doing so) and swore at his child's aunt, is that really an epiphany or a deep transformation? As for Superbad, there were pussy jokes, penis jokes and two guys expressing their love and loyalty for each other, something I thought most decent people would do anyway. How is this deep?

Posted by: Agente Provocatrice at January 8, 2008 3:51 PM

Also, re Waitress, I thought the similarities in tone and production between that and Pushing Daisies were striking; they're both pretty clearly modern-day stories set in a colorful fantasy realm, and you have to disconnect from reality a bit to enjoy them.

Re Juno being overly quirky or twee, I think you have to look at that genre of indie film kind of like Westerns or musicals or war films or sci fi: There are certain marks that have to be hit, e.g., the quirky characters, the wry humor, the weird small towns. Within the genre some are well-done and original (but within the template) and some are not, and one person may like one film but not another within the genre, even though they are somewhat similar.

Posted by: socalledonlycousins at January 8, 2008 3:55 PM

Am I hallucinating or did the Pajiba folks do a best movie moments of the year? For some reason I recall it but can't find it anywhere.

There were some great ones this year. My votes would go out to (trying my best to avoid spoilers by naming the movie first in case you haven't seen it yet):

- Zodiac - The pan over a nighttime San Francisco on July 4th (as well as the shot through the car window)

- No Country - Chigurh and Moss in the hotel

- There Will Be Blood - so many but the one that will stick with me is when Plainview is silhoutted against the derrick fire and he looks some hell-born bogeyman

- Gone Baby Gone - the one with Michele Monaghan leaning against the car near the end

- Juno - the last scene

- 28 Weeks Later - Don (Robert Carlyle) running from the zombies across that impossibly green grass

- Atonement - McAvoy's character writing the letter(s)

- Charlie Wilson's War - Wilson and Gust meet for the first time

- Michael Clayton - when Tilda Swinton is getting ready for her meetings

And my favorite:

- Ratatouille - when the critic takes a bite

(This last one is what I'm positive one of the Pajiba writers also called out) Me crazy?

Any other movie moments from y'all?

Posted by: Siddhartha at January 8, 2008 3:59 PM

Waitress is overrated. It was cute, it was sweet, Felicity looked amazing, but the end was so damn cheesy I had to laugh. And I was on a date! It was supposed to be romantic! I was completely underwhelmed, given the hype that I'd heard previous to my viewing.

I am not saying it was bad, far from it. It kind of reminds me of Pushing Daisies, or maybe that's just the pie speaking. Because I love pie. But honestly, it was not the best movie of the year. Not even close. You know what was?

I'll tell you. No Country for Old Men. 'Nuff said.

Posted by: Rachael at January 8, 2008 5:01 PM

Wow, socalled, I didn't even read your post before I posted. That is weeeeird.

Posted by: Rachael at January 8, 2008 5:03 PM

Barbadoslim, you raise a damn good point, about actors rising above the material but you have to remember what he was working against and the charaterisation he'd been given-that film was like ninety percent green screen, not to mention the character was written badly; Lucas didnt fully realise how to create a whole character out of the shade that was Vader, even though i hated SW even as a kid, one of the most affecting things about it was the mystery surrounding Vader, knowing he was Anakin was more than enough, i never felt an origins story was needed but frankly the character will never again be as frightening as he was, not because Hayden did a bad job, but because there's really no way to give Vader the origins without revealing what a little bitch he was.
Lucas could easily have made Vader evil based on a helluva lot more than he did,oh, lost love boo hoo, ya know? they could have had the slave thing played to better effect, made all three films darker, had Anakin have really suffered and so be more inclined to wicked ways when the light side of the force didnt provide the answers or what ever he needed.
Im not sure any one could have sold that, bear in mind as well the pressure on him, he'd have to know, playing this role, uttering every word that he was smashing this once great character to pieces...im not saying you HAVE to like him, just wait and see what else he does now, its not like w/Claire Danes who's sucked in everything i've ever seen her in, Hayden's been good in enough to make me believe there's talent there, IMO =)

Siddhartha, movie moments?
I've lots of great movie moments from 2007 despite my limited viewings-,these are based on sheer thrill value, resonance emotional or other ...

Obvious ones, are like, a great deal of Transformers, kinda focusing on the Optimus Prime reveals throughout, im an eighties kid pure and simple so as much as some people hated it fo me it was pure nostalgia like heroin in my veins; i was five again =)

Gone Baby Gone-two moments stood our for me through out the film in terms of acting and or resonance; in the club where Affleck gives a guy a Talking Too for insulting Monagon, Affleck's a genuine bad ass in that moment and the coolness of the delivery just cemented Affleck as Some One To Be Watched.
The second, its obvious again but its the last scene, where Affleck visits the kids mum and without giving away a spoiler, that last moment in the house, the last shot, spoke obvious but brilliant volumes.

Others aaaaaare 28 Weeks Later, more or less any moment with Jeremy Renner, the guys just incredible and adds a nice touch of depth to whats effectively a grunt.
the stand out one is the soldiers LOVING it when they gun down infected and uninfected people while Doyle(Renner) gets all existential.

Zodiac, just...erm, all of it. tbh. all of it.

Posted by: nadine at January 8, 2008 5:13 PM

"...im not saying you HAVE to like him, just wait and see what else he does now..."

Awake. Nuff said.

Posted by: Shadows of Dakaron at January 8, 2008 5:17 PM

I am way late to the party, but that warm glowy thing is real, and doesn't really wear off. I just rewatched a movie I love the other day, where a father is forced to choose between losing his daughter to the bad guys, or blowing his own head off, and he decides to off himself. The scene is incredible harrowing and tender all at once, and no matter how many times I've seen it, I still get teary-eyed since I know absolutely that I would make the same decision, with no second thoughts. I figure that has to come from all thoses warm, glowy feelings I still get 10 years after the fact, in spite of occasional tweeny brattiness.

Posted by: pinkcheese at January 8, 2008 5:33 PM

"...Hayden's been good in enough to make me believe there's talent there, IMO =).."

I hear ya :)

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at January 8, 2008 5:38 PM

I just did not get Knocked Up. The whole thing felt forced to me. Parts of it gave me a giggle, but stoners cataloging nude scenes and making beard jokes is only funny for about 5 minutes. I sure didn't feel the emotional depth everyone else did. In contrast Juno was consistently hilarious, the set-up didn't feel contrived and the acting was exceptional.

There Will Be Blood is my pick for film of the year, with No Country and The Assassination of Jesse James close behind.

Posted by: whenindoubt at January 8, 2008 5:45 PM

ZODIAC ZODIAC ZODIAC
Despite all my efforts, I had a the hardest time talking people into seeing Zodiac this year. It really was one of the year's best, and it's David Fincher's best (his stepping into 'adulthood' like Anderson's There Will Be Blood). I guess people think it's a slasher-pic, or just another Jake Gyllenhaal bum-out, or maybe it was a problem with marketing or release dates? But it's brilliant, beautiful, and scary, full of great music, all the best character actors with fun hairdos, and lush camerawork. It makes me super-nostalgic for the best 70's cinema like All The Presidents' Men. Read Manohla Dargis' critique of her favorite scene from it (in this week's NYTimes). My only beef: a strangely low-stakes performance from Ione "Diane Court" Skye.

Posted by: marianna at January 8, 2008 5:58 PM

Every year is Year of the Dude Movie. Sigh.

I didn't think Shallow Hall was funny, but I wasn't offended by the use of the fat suit in the film the way I was with Julia Roberts' "fat suit" in America's Sweethearts. With 60 fake pounds on, she didn't look fat: she looked like a normal human being. Apparently that's unattractive. It was depressing and made me angry. Fuck Hollywood.

On a Shallow Hal side note, was anyone else mesmerised/creeped the fuck out by the heinous, unnatural spray-on-carpet on the front part of Jason Alexander's head? Is it supposed to be hair? Is it painted on? Why is it flat? Why, god, why?!

Posted by: Lauren at January 8, 2008 6:41 PM

I'm simply not a fan of Knocked Up. It's not my style. Other than a great performance by Leslie Mann, perhaps more than the film is worth; it didn't catch my attention. Far, far too long for me.

I'm a little disappointed to see neither The Host or Bug here, but you can't have every movie.

Great entry, regardless!

Posted by: Brooke at January 8, 2008 7:34 PM

I can't even comment on movies this year. I've been too freaking busy to see any of the good ones that have come out over the past few months (Hell, I only recently saw Half Nelson, which was a damn fine movie). However, Hot Fuzz was by far the best thing that I saw. I heart Simon Pegg.

Ahh...you guys picked one of my own favorite topics...the fat girl/person topic. I always find it offensive not to myself but to others when people mock the overweight and morbidly obese. There is nothing funny about it. And, if the same people could delve into the minds of those that they malign, they would understand that most of these people know what they look like and are extremely self-conscious of the fact. Being a person who is not fat per se, but definitely over my desirable weight, I can vouch that however much confidence I exude to those around me (which is apparently a lot I am told) I am always self-conscious of the fact that I am not thin. Also, being a fashion addict doesn't help either, troz. I currently detest this whole skeletor look trend in fashion and in Hollywood. I am looking forward to the days when models' physiques will resemble Cindy Crawford as opposed to Kate Moss or Rachel Zoe, and skinny jeans and leggings will become obsolete once again. I liked how one commenter (Lauren) discussed the Julia Roberts fat suit scene in America's Sweethearts. This made me think of how "fat" Renee Zellweger was supposed to be in the original Bridget Jones' Diary. I love that movie to death, but Renee Zellweger was by no means fat in that movie. She looked like any woman off the street that did not worship daily at the shrine of the treadmill.

Posted by: Gigi Worthington at January 8, 2008 9:46 PM

I have read all the wonderful comments and engaging discussion, thought a lot about all the movies I've seen this year, and pondered what I would write, but I just can shake this central question:

Somebody liked Breach?

Oh. And Zodiac. My god, I loved that. It was the first time EVER in a movie based on true events that I didn't think to myself "I better read the book to find out what really happened." Well done.

Posted by: The Wandering Parakeet at January 8, 2008 9:53 PM

I completely agree with boo. I would take Superbad over Knocked Up. I thought both were funny movies, but Superbad was slightly movie. But something I have found about Apatow's movies that I don't about my favorite comedies(Super Troopers, Blazing Saddles) is that the more I watch them, the less I seem to like them. And I've only watched them about 3 or 4 times now, and they are starting to wear on me.

As for best of '07, I have to pick between No Country For Old Men and Juno. Although I haven't seen waitress or Lars and the Real Girl yet (or AvP:R! sorry). I have to give the nod to Juno. No Country was an incredible movie, but left me wanting more in a bad sense, just as Dustin described. Juno left me wanting more in the best way. I fell in love with everyone in Juno so much, and even felt a little betrayed at a certain plot twist I was so involved. I was as invested in this movie as I was in Little Miss Sunshine last year.

Posted by: Moose at January 9, 2008 1:16 AM

GAH! I just got back from watching There Will Be Blood and...well...that is some messed up shit. I realize that this was a good movie - great acting, captivating story, complex characters, fantastic writing, yadda yadda yadda - but it creeped me out beyond belief. I DON'T LIKE IT when movies do that to me. I have not gotten the willies from a movie like that since...well, probably since Requiem for a Dream. Really different film, but same feeling. Just - augh - that - I don't know...ARE PEOPLE SERIOUSLY THIS DEPRAVED?!? And fucked up!?!?
Parts of TWBB were truly funny - they were - but soooo twisted. Daniel Day-Lewis did a ridiculously fine job here (I still liked him best in In the Name of the Father). Now if I could just get some of the creepy shit that he says out of my head...

Posted by: tt_marie at January 9, 2008 1:21 AM

Oh, was Hot Fuzz a 2007 movie?! Good grief, can't believe I forgot that one, it was a damn good comedy.

Posted by: MO at January 9, 2008 8:01 AM

I thought "Zodiac" was great, too! SPOILERSPOILER I thought the scene where the Zodiac killer murdered that couple in broad daylight was terrifying and thought about it for days afterwards. SPOILERSPOILER

Posted by: Samantha T at January 9, 2008 11:40 AM

So where's Grindhouse?

Posted by: victoria at January 9, 2008 11:52 AM

the pregnancy movies seem to get the most attention here. the major difference between " knocked up " and " " juno " is that the first is funny but instantly forgettable and the second will stay with you.
" gone, baby, gone " deserved a lot more attention.
i don't understand the bandwagon impact of " there will be blood ". does everyone love this over long character study of a sociopath? day-lewis is a fine actor but he is billy the butcher all over again. there are interesting touches along the way but the nonsenical ending cannot be redeemed.
best movie moments ? ...

morgan freeman's final plea to an implacable casey affleck in " GBG "...

confrontation between clooney and pollack when clooney asks for the $80,000 in " michael clayton".

the farewell between hal holbrook and the protagonist in " into the wild "...

Posted by: snake at January 9, 2008 12:17 PM

the pregnancy movies seem to get the most attention here. the major difference between " knocked up " and " " juno " is that the first is funny but instantly forgettable and the second will stay with you.
" gone, baby, gone " deserved a lot more attention.
i don't understand the bandwagon impact of " there will be blood ". does everyone love this over long character study of a sociopath? day-lewis is a fine actor but he is billy the butcher all over again. there are interesting touches along the way but the nonsenical ending cannot be redeemed.
best movie moments ? ...

morgan freeman's final plea to an implacable casey affleck in " GBG "...

confrontation between clooney and pollack when clooney asks for the $80,000 in " michael clayton".

the farewell between hal holbrook and the protagonist in " into the wild "...

Posted by: snake at January 9, 2008 12:18 PM

RE pregnancy movies: so many movies in which unexpected (and thus likely unwanted) pregnancy is the main plot are done so badly, I think any movie in which it's done with any intelligence or nuance is probably given a little more credit than it otherwise would. I saw all three movies named, liked them all, for different reasons. They're just movies. Knocked Up was funny, Waitress was sweet and funny in parts, Juno was sweet and funny.

RE Sunshine: I liked it too, but I didn't care for the "boogeyman" plot. Guess they had to do something to explain the other ship. Still visually stunning, as are all of his movies. I liked 28 Weeks Later well enough too. Not as good as the first one, it would be really hard for anyone to do that (I realize Boyle didn't direct that one, but wanted to mention).

RE Transformers, Resident Evil 3: I saw these too and liked them well enough and I'm not ashamed. Transformers was dumb as hell, but entertaining enough (I saw it at the cheap movies, so I was out only $1 if it blew; there is a direct correlation between my rating of a movie and how much I paid to see it). Resident Evil, of course, dumb, but what the hell. Milla Jovovich killin' zombies. What is not to like about that? Wish I could find that red dress somewhere and buy it.

RE Into The Wild: have not seen the movie but have an inkling of what it's about. The kid was an idiot. They tell you not to go off into the wilderness alone for a reason. And I read somewhere that more people disappear and are never seen again in Alaska every year than in any other state. They get injured, die of exposure and then are eaten by animals.

RE fat suits: yeah, I hate the fat suit shit too (I actually don't think Tyler Perry's Madea character is supposed to be making fun of fat women, but the other examples clearly are). Fat jokes are what racist jokes once were (or still are, for a few people). A way for unfunny, insecure people to get a cheap laugh from idiots. Eddie Murphy really should be ashamed of Norbit. Does he need the money that damn bad?

Posted by: Slash at January 9, 2008 1:27 PM

Your lack of respect for McEwan disturbs me, Dustin. But that brings up an interesting point that has been overlooked so far in these exchanges: Some of the top films this year, as in recent years, are based on books. You all are raving about the Cohen brothers, but shouldn't at least half of the praise be thrown Cormac McCarthy's way? As I understand it, the movie is pretty much identical and true to the book (as is "Atonement," except for a few minor scenes). I love the movie "Atonement" because I loved the book, but in singing my praises, I'm not commending Joe Wright -- it's all about McEwan.

Where's the love for the first writers -- the first creators?

Posted by: Sarah at January 9, 2008 2:19 PM

[i]GAH! I just got back from watching There Will Be Blood and...well...that is some messed up shit. I realize that this was a good movie - great acting, captivating story, complex characters, fantastic writing, yadda yadda yadda - but it creeped me out beyond belief. I DON'T LIKE IT when movies do that to me. I have not gotten the willies from a movie like that since...well, probably since Requiem for a Dream. Really different film, but same feeling. Just - augh - that - I don't know...ARE PEOPLE SERIOUSLY THIS DEPRAVED?!? And fucked up!?!?
Parts of TWBB were truly funny - they were - but soooo twisted. Daniel Day-Lewis did a ridiculously fine job here (I still liked him best in In the Name of the Father). Now if I could just get some of the creepy shit that he says out of my head...[/i] - tt_marie

I had the exact same reaction as I walked out of the theater! My date actually asked me what was wrong because I was so quiet. It took me a few days to mull it over and I realize that I love that movie. It grabbed me at my core and shook it out. And I didn't find it boring at all. I could have sat there another hour.

There Will Be Blood and No Country For Old Men are my favorites of the movies I've seen this year. I liked Sweeney Todd and Atonement, but didn't love either one of them. Atonement had a boring second act and Sweeney Todd lacked depth. I'm going to have to add most of the acclaimed movies of 2007 to my Netflix list...

I really really want to see Juno before it leaves theaters though!

Posted by: kayla at January 9, 2008 5:16 PM

Dustin...

twemtysomethings should perhaps maybe quite possibly be twentysomethings? Or is it some inside joke thing I missed?

So much for spell check, eh? :)

I stopped reading there as twemty had me perplexed. Will finish later, something shinier caught my eye.

Posted by: WhoWhatWhere at January 10, 2008 12:17 AM

Let me just jump in here to say that I read "She's come Undone" as a depressed, overweight teenage girl and absolutely adored it. I disagree with the comment that the book depicted the self-loathing and suicide attempts as the only options for oveweight teenagers growing up in western society. It most certainly isn't. I'm a mature, intelligent, 23 year old woman now who still suffers from the occasional bout of low self-esteem. If I could travel back in time and meet my 16 year old self, I would have told her to brush her hair, get some sunlight and realize that you define the way the world sees you, not the other way around. What I think the book and its author did a fantastic job of capturing, is that for many girls who grew up like me, there doesn't seem to be any happiness or success in the future simply because of what we see in the mirror. For those who read the book, you've chosen to omit the fact that while the main character's weight is the theme, it's more of a symptom of what's going on in her life. She was going through a deep depression while her life was falling apart around her and one of the few solaces she could find was in food, which she would gorge on. Her lack of self-control would turn to self-loathing and the cycle continued. And I doubt that anyone can say that they haven't been there to some degree or know someone else who's been struggling, or is still struggling with this vicious cycle.

That being said, I'd have to agree that there haven't been enough "fat" heroines in the literary and cinematic world. I look forward to the days where a character's weight is merely incidental and not a character trait. The only thing I can think of right now which approaches this is "Ugly Betty". Think what you will of the show but the character's weight has never been an issue. Even in her "ugliness" Betty is still good, smart, semi-successful and attractive to the opposite sex.

On the movie front, "Knocked Up" bored me to tears but people who've gone through the whole pregnancy roller-coaster seem to really connect with it and I generally like the Apatow flavour so I probably just don't have the experience to go with the subject matter. Although the stoner characters were completely unsympathetic to me so I don't really see how I could relate. In defense of that new genre, Apatow has done what many directors before him have done and that is capture the behaviour, speech, ideology and humour of this generation. It may be a chicken or the egg discussion, but the characters he and his brood create are exactly like the youth I see around me ever day. It may be a chicken or the egg situation, but Apatow and this latest brand of humour seeks to showcase the actors/people themselves, and, more specifically, the language and speech that come out of sitting around with your friends on a Friday night playing "Guitar Hero" and discussing the profound meaning of nothing at all, with the aid of your college education behind you. These movies will stand the test of time moreso that other "teen movie" fare because it's honest and tries to be as realistic as possible and therein is the humour and the brilliance, if not the the depth. The reason people other than Apatow have been mostly unsuccessful is because they are trying to copy a style that wasn't created, but cultivated through interaction and true companionship and camaraderie.

Wow, that was long. OKay, off my soapbox and back to the lurking ether, but I just needed to get that off my chest.

Posted by: BMG at January 10, 2008 12:34 AM

sorry, quick correction

* Apatow captures the voice of this generation much like directors before him captured the voice of their own respective generation.

* and I said "Chicken and the egg" twice. sorry

carry on.

Posted by: BMG at January 10, 2008 12:38 AM

Okay, so here's the premise for the next pregnancy movie:

Based on the real life story of britney spears' little sister, how she managed to remain trailer trash once famous and wealthy. Or better yet, let's just go on over to that double wide a few miles down from me (we could take the bottle of JB!) and see the REAL sixteen year old pregnant chick. That's be real cute and sweet and funny and indie, right? Talk about your shaken baby...

Posted by: VeinsRHiways at January 10, 2008 2:36 AM

barbadoslim, i appreciate that you dont just shrug off a reply, you actually seem to read and think about it, its a rare and wondrous thing =)

Posted by: nadine at January 10, 2008 2:04 PM

Was I wrong to love Sicko? I wouldn't go so far as to say the best of the year, but waaaaaaaay better than Waitress...And am I the only one who would be more than a little creeped out by my gyno (okay, technically OB) hitting on me AFTER the first examination? I had to suspend disbelief a little too much for that one). Just sayin...

Posted by: joeyjeremiah at January 10, 2008 8:12 PM

Ok..I know I'm late on this one, and I'll admit that I only got about 3/4 of the way through the comments before having to post out of total frustration. No love for 3:10 To Yuma? That was by far one of my favorite movies of the year along with Gone Baby Gone. The pregnancy trifecta were all entertaining in their own special way, but 3:10 and GBG blew my socks off. (And BTW I'm a woman, and a mother. So I get the whole mushy life-changing pregnancy thing, it's real, it happens, but enough of it already!)

P.S. If anyone did mention 3:10 to Yuma and I either overlooked it or didn't make it to your post yet, I sincerely apologize.

Posted by: Pudenda at January 13, 2008 11:12 AM

I just can't stand anything that Apatow has been associated with. Don't know why I don't think any of his stuff is particularly funny.

Posted by: Adam C at January 13, 2008 11:46 AM

I should have known. Apologies to Smello, Jon, and Socalledonly. Posted, went back and finished reading the comments, and all three of you had already stated my feelings to a certain degree. Guess that's what happens when you post before you read...

Posted by: Pudenda at January 13, 2008 12:18 PM

Best, most realistic pregnancy movie: Fargo. It's just part of the story like everything else is. Marge wasn't annoyingly cutesefied or pathologized - she was just pregnant. No irritating "Oh, my God, my HORMONES" scenes, no nothing.

Posted by: Samantha T at January 15, 2008 6:11 AM


















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