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We’re All About Coulda, Not Shoulda


Watchmen / Daniel Carlson

Film Reviews | March 6, 2009 | Comments (196)


Adapting a comic book into a film — not just a character or group of them, like Batman or the X-Men, but a full-on book — is a confusing thing. Comics are already a visual medium, and though their beats and styles differ from movies, they are both still ways to tell a story that rely on what the reader/viewer sees. Saying a comic book would make a good movie is like saying a newspaper article would make a good magazine feature; yeah, okay, sure, but wouldn’t that be just a little redundant? How this all relates to Watchmen will only really be known with time. Director Zack Snyder, in only his third feature, has confirmed that he’s a filmmaker obsessed with detail at the expense of emotion, and while that worked pretty well for 300 — based on Frank Miller’s slick but flat graphic novel — it doesn’t always jibe with Watchmen. The comic book from Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons was remarkable for its depth and nuance of character, and any film version must out of necessity excise whole chunks of psychological development in order to come up with something that plays like a feature. Working from a script by David Hayter (X-Men, X2) and Alex Tse, Snyder is devoted to the source material, creating the most fastidious and loyal re-creation possible, but he’s also hampered by the fact that no amount of love for the book can make it a good movie, and in fact the closer it stays to the original, the less cinematic it becomes. As adaptations go, Snyder has created an often beautiful pop opera, a soaring and visually stunning series of images that are capable of striking a chord. But as for making a cohesive, flowing narrative that stands as its own film and not a live mimic of a comic, Snyder comes up short.

The film opens with the murder of the Comedian (Jeffrey Dean Morgan), an aging superhero long since retired. It’s 1985, Nixon has been reelected several times after American victory in Vietnam, and professional heroes have been outlawed. The Comedian is watching TV when an assailant breaks into his apartment, at which point they have the typically bone-crunching fight you’d expect from Snyder that results in the Comedian being tossed out his window, dying when he hits the pavement. Snyder’s study of the source material is evident from the beginning, right down to the details on the Comedian’s ratty robe, but he’s also still endeared of the gimmick he overplayed in 300 where action will suddenly slip into slow-motion before snapping back to real time. He’s attempting to create visual pauses in the film that ape the way a reader is allowed to study details in comics, but it comes off as half-hearted when the rest of the scene is allowed to pass in a blur. The best part of the film’s opening, actually, is the credit sequence that manages to beautifully sum up the backstory of the Watchmen universe, tracing the rise and fall of the heroes of the 1940s, bleeding into the alternate history of the nation, and finally winding up with the resurrected Watchmen themselves in the 1970s. Snyder assembles a series of living pictures that elliptically fill in the blanks, and the sequence is set against Bob Dylan’s “The Times They Are a-Changin’” in a way that underscored Snyder’s background in music videos. There’s a real beauty and tragedy to the sequence that, more than anything else that follows, gets at the heart of the sense of loss that Snyder is trying to capture, that sense that the old days were better than these. The rest of the film wanders onward and never manages to drive home the emotion of the opening.

The Comedian’s death kicks off the main plot when his murder is investigated by Rorschach (Jackie Earle Haley), a hero living outside the law who wears a mask with constantly changing inkblot patterns. Rorschach is somewhere between criminally insane and just really motivated in his mission, and he was created to show just one of many different possible moral compasses to which people could adhere; Moore, rather than offer a parable, mixed together characters with disparate belief systems, each flawed but redeemable, in order to create a more densely layered story. But Snyder’s film makes both too much and too little of Rorschach’s ruthlessness, content to portray him as a slightly wacko guy who loves to break people’s fingers on the road to what he perceives to be justice. Rorschach believes that someone is intentionally killing superheroes, so he sets out to warn the remaining Watchmen: Adrian Veidt (Matthew Goode), revered as the smartest man alive, whose hero persona was Ozymandias and who’s now turned to private enterprise; Dan Dreiberg (Patrick Wilson), formerly the Nite Owl, who goes about his lonely life afraid of success and failure alike; and Laurie Jupiter (Malin Akerman), aka Silk Spectre, and Jon Osterman (Billy Crudup), aka Dr. Manhattan, still doing contract work for the government. Dr. Manhattan is the only one of the group with actual superpowers, having been turned blue and iridescent in an atomic blast that made him indestructible, allowed to perceive the past and future simultaneously, and teleport himself and others anywhere he wants. The bulk of the graphic novel’s plot, summarized for the film, involves the relationship between the drifting members of the former crimefighting group and the imminent nuclear war between the U.S.S.R. and the United States.

Key to the novel’s complexity is the way it examines the lives of the heroes and digs at what made them decide to put on silly costumes and capture bad guys in the first place, as well as the plaguing question of what it means to live a moral life when the very definitions of morality are being stripped from the world. Snyder makes a brave attempt to capture this on film, and in moments examining the characters’ individual backstories, he comes closer than anyone could have imagined at creating tiny glimpses into their motivations. But it’s that tangential nature to the story that makes it such a good book and weak film. Snyder is almost fetishistically faithful to the source material, going so far as to maintain the feeling (if not literal demarcation) of chapters in the story. And some of the scenes with Dr. Manhattan manage to convey the damning isolation of free will that haunts the character and the book. But while Snyder stumbles upon compelling moments — Osterman’s narration of his life, death, and resurrection is so well done that the effects never detract from the heartbreak — he never maintains momentum, losing his way in the transitions from one part of the story to the next. And at a running time of 163 minutes, Snyder definitely needs to know how to handle himself. “Epic” should carry with it grandeur of impact, not just length.

The film roams from plot point to plot point as Rorschach’s investigation of the Comedian’s murder brings him closer to the truth, while Dan and Laurie find themselves working together again and suiting up to save their part of the world. Snyder and company have definitely cast for look over skill in many cases, because while Wilson is good at being charming and nerdy, Akerman is often painfully wooden in a role that should help anchor the main narrative. (Her mother, Sally Jupiter, is played with equal camp by Carla Gugino; whether the hiring of two bad actresses with similarly clumsy styles of delivery was a fluke or amazingly high-concept is something we’ll never know.) This is also where Snyder’s film makes a rare diversion from the book that nevertheless harms the movie even more. We’re meant to believe that Laurie is the grown-up daughter of an old woman, and that Dan has gained weight and gone soft since hanging up his cowl, but there is no way Wilson and Akerman are anything other than beautiful people, both several years younger than their comic book counterparts, looking more like heroes in their prime than alter egos long past it. Wilson at least has legitimate theater and film credits to his name, but Akerman launched her career by going topless in Harold & Kumar Go to White Castle. If this is the vehicle meant to showcase her dramatic range, she’s going to have to wait.

Of his seminal work, Moore said, “I didn’t design it to show off the similarities between cinema and comics, which are there but in my opinion are fairly unremarkable. It was designed to show off the things that comics could do that cinema and literature couldn’t.” Snyder isn’t the first filmmaker to see this as a challenge, but because he’s the one who brought the film to fruition, he’ll have to be the one held responsible for failing to ask the larger question: not whether Watchmen can be filmed but whether it should be adapted in the first place. The graphic novel is rightly considered on the best ever written — it ranked on Time magazine’s 100 best novels of the 20th century — and as such a film version can only ever be that: an emotionally abridged take on a story already told. Snyder’s film is a technical marvel that’s nevertheless cold and somehow unapproachable, as if the characters’ sense of being alone in the face of the apocalypse bled into Snyder himself and tainted his work. It’s sadly ironic that Snyder was so devoted to a story that deals in part with global superpowers’ decision to annihilate each other that he never stopped to think of the consequences of making a movie that can’t survive or be fully explained without its source novel while at the same time losing whatever in that source was special. Snyder wants to save the village, but he just winds up destroying it.

Daniel Carlson is the managing editor of Pajiba and a low-level employee at a Hollywood industry magazine. You can visit his blog, Slowly Going Bald.


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Comments

A variation: how the hell am I first?

Anyway, considering the mixed reactions, and how everyone interprets a book differently, it seems to be one of those movies you're just going to have to see for yourself.

Posted by: dsbs at March 6, 2009 7:21 PM

did you intentionally not mention that there is maybe too much glowing blue penis in the movie?

Posted by: downtown eddie brown at March 6, 2009 7:26 PM

I should certainly hope so, dsbs.

Posted by: Jay at March 6, 2009 7:29 PM

I'm delurking for this one.. I caught the midnight showing of this and definitely agree with your review. I was never really for Watchmen being made into a movie, but at the same time I wasn't disappointed.

I thought it could have been a much bigger train wreck and I appreciated Snyder's loyalty to the original material, even if that may have hurt him in the end.

Posted by: Penelope at March 6, 2009 7:30 PM

This lady says that if you see this movie, you're "a vapid, indecent human being." She also fears that children who get a glimpse of blue peen will suffer devastating lifelong damage.

I figured Pajiba readers might want to hear the other side of the argument--y'know, the uninformed, inarticulate shit-for-brains perspective.

Posted by: Jerce at March 6, 2009 7:41 PM

163 minutes?


That's a rental.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at March 6, 2009 7:45 PM

The Dick of Manhattan caused quite an uproar in my theater. But what really must be mentioned is the most ridiculous Nixon impression since Billy West's in Futurama.
"Well, I say, that Dr. Manhattan's a pretty swell guy. Aroo."

Posted by: Optimus Rhyme at March 6, 2009 7:48 PM

A question for those who have braved/will brave the crowds this weekend: If I go to the theater a weekend or two hence, will Watchmen still be playing to a full house, or will I have a choice of seating?

Posted by: Jerce at March 6, 2009 7:51 PM

Also, did anyone else have a problem with the soundtrack? I thought it was extremely off in places. Tarantino he is not.

Posted by: Optimus Rhyme at March 6, 2009 7:51 PM

As someone who sadly never read the original Watchmen (yes people like me exist!)I have no high nor low expectations of this. Curiousity alone drives me here. If this thing is as badly off as Daniel states it just may be morbid curiousity. Hope to hell not though 'cause I'll be spending money on this thing!

Posted by: Four Eyes at March 6, 2009 7:53 PM

To be honest with you Jerce i'd rather have blue peen than blue balls.

Posted by: Pookie at March 6, 2009 7:54 PM

Jerce, I'm not sure if I should be thanking you for linking to that gibbering woman. I can't believe I read her entire article, but the comments were even more mind-blowing - responding to anyone that disagrees with THEY ARE MARKETING THIS TO KIDS is a tough line to argue with. Especially when all she does is repeat that over and over.

I will see it, having just read it last weekend, and am very curious to see how it compares. The mister is very anti-opening night but I can't see something like being a sold-out show in this town.

Posted by: Anne (in Reno) at March 6, 2009 7:55 PM

Just got back from catching an early showing of Watchmen (IMAX tomorrow). And let me begin by congratulating Snyder for making what I think is the closest adaptation of Watchmen that could possibly be made. I loathe to imagine what a Brett Ratner or Tim Story Watchmen could have looked like.

Is it a great movie? No. In that Moore was always right: his comic book issues allowed him the freedom and the breathing room to explore further than even a 3-hr movie ever could. He got a chance to explore and give you such depth to each of his characters and the world around them. Naturally, a lot of that was excised from the movie.

Now, does that make it a bad movie? Absolutely not. Most of the cast does well -- Haley's Rorschach being the obvious standout. The production crew gets the look of the book nearly perfect. Most of the special effects work great -- with the occassional odd blips.

Posted by: Fredo at March 6, 2009 8:04 PM

Saw this the other night in an advance screening... I thought the movie was going to be absolutely amazing until I read the comic. When I finished the last page I realized that it was going to be impossible to make a film adaptation that can even hope to match the complexity of the comic without making it roughly a million hours long. Having seen it, I wasn't wrong, but the flick wasn't terrible either. I'm willing to give high marks for accuracy and, quite frankly, this is probably the best attempt at a Watchmen movie we're ever going to get. I mostly enjoyed it is what I'm saying.

Except for Ackerman. She fucking sucked.

Posted by: madamz at March 6, 2009 8:05 PM

So, what's all this stuff I hear about a blue penis? Is Papa Smurf one of the watchmen or something? He fathered all the smurfs, so you know he's packing.

Posted by: SofĂ­a at March 6, 2009 8:28 PM

I'll pass. Maybe when it's out on DVD, but for now, I'll pass.

Posted by: Lucas at March 6, 2009 8:29 PM

It's rated R for a reason. Kids shouldn't see it. It's really very violent and there's all kinds of dick and ass and boobies.
It's a tiny blue dick. But it's true to the comic and pretty bold.

Posted by: Optimus Rhyme at March 6, 2009 8:36 PM

A pox of flaming hemorrhoids upon the foul Paliban who just informed me that I share this planet with Debbie Schlussel. I just read the entire contents of that link, and am now going to go drown myself in a hot bath.

Posted by: Poultice at March 6, 2009 8:39 PM

I'd have traded the 7 min segments of Hostel-homage graphic violence, slo-mo ejaculations of spent rounds, soft-core stupidity and otherwise uninspired mid-panel fill-ins Snyder pulled out of his ass for more than 20 seconds of the Newsstand...I'm just saying.

Posted by: anitra at March 6, 2009 8:43 PM

It's a tiny blue dick.

Now I see why you didn't end wearing that Doctor Manhattan costume to the showing, OR: your third arm would create accuracy issues as compared with the film. The news probably would've reported it as the first blue whale sighting in Michigan history.

Posted by: branded at March 6, 2009 8:47 PM

"Rorschach is somewhere between criminally insane and just really motivated in his mission, and he was created to show just one of many different possible moral compasses to which people could adhere"

So he's Pookie with a mask?

Posted by: L.O.V.E. at March 6, 2009 8:57 PM

What do you mean? It didn't seem small to anyone else?

Posted by: Optimus Rhyme at March 6, 2009 8:57 PM

What do you mean? It didn't seem small to anyone else?

Not when he was taller than a building...

Posted by: Sabrina at March 6, 2009 9:04 PM

Thanks for that little glimpse of retardo-hell, Jerce.

On the other hand, thanks for a well thought out review Dan. It sounds like, while it's not great, it may well be the best adaptation we could hope for.

Posted by: I Love Beets at March 6, 2009 9:09 PM

I've never read the book but I'm still excited about watching this whenever it gets released here (say two or three months), though I have to say I cringed when I read about the slo-mo. It's such a tired gimmick, and I hope the rest of the movie isn't as...comic-book-ish as 300 was, because I could NOT stand the visuals in that movie.

I love super hero movies, and despite the flaws Dan mentions it still sounds like a fun ride. But oof...so long. I might wait for a rental.

Posted by: figgy at March 6, 2009 9:26 PM

Because I'm an artist (or perhaps why I am one) I often get caught up in visuals, movies, walking down the street, etc. And this movie was sometimes so visually beautiful, in a baroque way, that I didn't make out the dialogue.

Akerman is truly terrible, especially when contrasted with great performances by Jeffrey Dean Morgan and Jackie Earle Haley. Although when Haley's mask comes off I couldn't help wondering how the hell Danny Bonaducci got there.

And, yippie for the glowing blue penis!

Posted by: Sharopa at March 6, 2009 9:34 PM

This review was beautiful, but I'm glad that they did things as right as possible. I'll go see it, and post my own thoughts tomorrow.

Posted by: George at March 6, 2009 9:37 PM

Saw it this morning, walked out after 1.5 hours. Didn't read the source material, and don't care how faithful the adaptation was, except to the extent that the baby-boomer soundtrack signals that this should have been filmed back when it was written, or not at all.

I may not be the target audience for Watchmen, but I sat down wanting to like it, and I'm willing to give dystopia a chance. But come on, am I really supposed to give a shit about the fate of a character (The Comedian) who commits exactly zero commendable acts, but several outright vile ones, just because another character bestows a halfhearted apology for him, and because he experiences a just-prior-to-deathbed conversion switcheroo? Sorry, not after all the fetishized brutality that came before. Piece of shit.

Posted by: sansho1 at March 6, 2009 9:56 PM

About the blue penis, I'm reminded of what Robert Altman once said. The problem with showing waist-down nudity, he said, is that the entire audience is distracted by it to the point that any dramatic tension is lost. That was certainly the case here, as I found myself wondering not about the size of Dr. Manhattan's penis, but what the hell happened to his nutsack....

Posted by: sansho1 at March 6, 2009 10:13 PM

Excellent review, but I feel that this is a movie for people who have read the novel. It can only be, and should only be just that; one for the fans.

Some may like it and decide to read the book after seeing it, but they'll enjoy it more seeing it again AFTER having read it.

So. Yeah. Technically, a spot-on review. But this is a special movie for a specific audience. And this audience loved it.

Posted by: ben (thpbt) at March 6, 2009 10:45 PM

Moore, rather than offer a parable, mixed together characters with disparate belief systems, each flawed but redeemable

I think I missed that. I just sat through it and the whole time I was thinking that it was one bloated, allegorical ode to a Deist mindset. I truely felt like I was being whacked repeatedly over the head, not only with Dr. Manhattan's ubiquitous pingding, but with all the crap about clocks and miracles and shit. I defintely couldn't find any "disparate beliefs systems". Just jaded resignation and a hint that one of the writer's might have taken a philosophy course in the past decade.

I won't say that it was a bad film, but it definitely annoyed me. Not to mention that I'm the type of girl who is easily distracted by a penis. Blue or otherwise. Good thing that mess wasn't in 3D.

Posted by: J_Capri at March 6, 2009 11:07 PM

And Jeffrey Dean Morgan has a personal invitation to come and gnaw on my ass. Any day of the week.

Posted by: J_Capri at March 6, 2009 11:09 PM

Oh crud, I just realized you said Moore and not Snyder... even as I quoted you... Ignore.

Posted by: J_Capri at March 6, 2009 11:23 PM

I'm assuming they handed out large blue peni-straws at the theatre to go with your drink? Seems like a logical promotional item.

Posted by: Lauren at March 6, 2009 11:29 PM

But come on, am I really supposed to give a shit about the fate of a character (The Comedian)

No, you're not. The Comedian's death is basically a MacGuffin, it sets the plot in motion but the story ends up in a very different place. But on the subject of the ending, I did think the end of the movie was pretty much a big letdown compared to the end of the book, for reasons that had nothing to do with a certain missing critter and more to do with the simplistic way the "villain" and his motivations were portrayed in the movie, not to mention the movie's failure to create any real tension about the prospect of nuclear war--those Dr. Strangelove Nixon scenes came across more as "Family Guy" level parody than serious drama.

Posted by: Jesse M. at March 6, 2009 11:53 PM

That was no promotional item. You have to more careful about the theaters you go to.

Posted by: mrcreosote at March 6, 2009 11:54 PM

That was quite possibly the funniest sex scene I have ever seen in my life. The entire theater (midnight, so bunches of fanboys) was hysterical.

Posted by: jvo at March 7, 2009 12:07 AM

The Comedian was an integral part of the other characters' lives, and in the riot scene he elucidates the worldview of the creators. That's not a MacGuffin. We're manipulated into identifying with him (he always gets the last word, his killing is the provider of symbolism and the driver of the plot), but the depiction of his vile acts is protracted beyond the point where anything meaningful is being said about moral compromise.

Posted by: sansho1 at March 7, 2009 12:13 AM

As someone who loved the book, I'm reluctant to see the movie. It's a book, and I like it, but if it's a movie then it's not the thing I like any more. I don't buy this notion that if something is successful in one medium it should be translated into every other one. Watchmen is a book, it's no more a movie than it is a helicopter or sculpture.

And what is all this nonsense about Zak Snyder being a 'Visionary Director'? Because he can use slow motion? Because he spells his name without the 'c'? The dude remade a zombie movie; all zombie movies are the same anyway, but he had to remake one. Then he made a panel for panel adaptation of a comic. Where does the 'visionary' come in?

Posted by: James at March 7, 2009 12:27 AM

The Comedian was an integral part of the other characters' lives,

None of whom liked him, except possibly for Rorschach who is also portrayed as extremely demented.

and in the riot scene he elucidates the worldview of the creators.

Uh, where did you get that idea? The dialogue in the riot scene is taken almost directly from the book, and it's very obvious that Alan Moore considers him to be a frighteningly fascistic character and (along with Rorscach) a sociopath.

Posted by: Jesse M. at March 7, 2009 12:30 AM

Apropos of nothing: I was at a book store today and there is actually a biography of the TWILIGHT guy. Some people's kids. He looked so dirty on the cover, even the pubic crabs wouldn't have him.

I have a notoriously low tolerance for onscreen violence, so I won't be seeing this. Wish I didn't, but I do. Wusses are people, too. I also have no patience for Ackerman being lightweight and taking up space, at least not when my money's involved.

I have not heard the greatest things about Crudup's performance. The ads I see on the subway look like Blue Man Group castoffs, but that's neither here nor there. I'm sure it's another thing altogether on an IMAX. As far as I remember about the book, Jon Osterman leaves his long-term partner for a tart who's too young for him. It's the role Crudup was born to play--he was Stanislavsi-ing this joint ages ago.

Maybe he should've paid more attention to the Milton Burle tapes he had laying around if he was looking for inspiration. You know-- *ooooooohhhhhhhhhhhh*, snap!

When you finally did see Rorschack's face in the novel, you can't help but think, 'This Archie Andrews/Alfred E. Neuman hybrid is the masked vigilante? Dag.' Do you get the same whiplash effect from seeing Jo Jackie Osment-sprey Excelsis Capri Sun Earle of Sandwich?

Wait, now I've forgotten his real name. I think I've got Ocean Madness.

Posted by: Jo 'Mama' Besser at March 7, 2009 12:35 AM

Just got back from an early showing...
I agree that this is mostly a adaptation for fans of the comic book. Without that frame of reference, I can see how the film would fall pretty flat. It still fell totally flat in a couple of places, but kept me focused and entertained for the vast majority of the movie.

To me, the major difference comes in how the 'super heroism' is treated. In the novel, the absurdity of people wearing masks and trying to fight crime is always in the forefront. Snyder, however, still seems to think this is a superhero movie he's making. They move in slow motion and have amazing strength, etc. Ultimately, while that is fun to look at, it comes at the expense of a lot of what made the novel so original and compelling.

Posted by: phaedawg at March 7, 2009 12:44 AM

just got back. am i the only one who's going to complain that there wasn't nearly enough cock?

i wanted billy and patrick to dry hump my fourth wall.
in slo-mo.
for 163 minutes.
to
*spoiler alert*

kc and the sunshine band.

Posted by: gp at March 7, 2009 12:44 AM

Seriously, this movie could not have been/felt longer. On another note, Malin Ackerman is a stiff and terrible actress; I hope she stops getting roles after this crap.

Posted by: Stephanie at March 7, 2009 1:09 AM

It's kinda funny in a way. I often criticize movies for not being faithful ENOUGH to the source material and i definitely thought that would be the case with this as well because you can summarize Hollis Mason's "Under The Hood" or the reading of "The Black Freighter" into a movie? The story deviates so often from the present narrative that I figured Snyder wouldn't use a lot of it. It sounds, though, that it was his very faithfulness to the novel that was the film's downfall.
I can see people who haven't read the graphic novel having a hard time understanding the film, would I be wrong in that assumption?

I fucking love that novel though and nothing will stop me from seeing this movie about 10 times in theatres.

Oh, and I must admit, there is something I find woefully endearing about Malin Akerman...I keep hoping that her next film will be her breakthrough but I guess she's just a shitty actress.

Posted by: citizen_cris at March 7, 2009 1:14 AM

Spot on review Dan- while the fanboy in me was in geek nirvana, the movie lover checked his watch a few times. In his dogged pursuit of the source material, it is almost as if Snyder forgot to make a film. Glad you mentioned the opening sequence, it got across huge amounts of context with remarkable economy. Rorschach, the Comedian and Dreiberg were spot on but Laurie & Manhatten were pretty flat.

And the soundtrack...I never thought Leonard Cohen could ruin anything, but somehow Snyder found a way. As for the placement of "Everybody wants to Rule the World"- as someone already said it, Snyder is no Tarantino.

It was too episodic in nature for the rythmns of cinema and as has already been mentioned, it was never going to capture all the nuances of the book (granted, few adaptations ever do). Would have worked better as a tv/dvd maxi series rather than a single film.

Posted by: Dave Shepherd at March 7, 2009 1:18 AM

Jerce-
that Debbie-person's review... uh.... okay. I'm practically speechless. Never before has a movie review had me screaming "you fucking IDIOT" at my monitor before. I thought I was going to have a stroke.
/deep breaths

Posted by: nancy at March 7, 2009 1:57 AM

In a cage match between poor choices for adaptations, who would win: Watchmen or Benjamin Button?

My vote is for Watchmen since it didn't pretend that I had to care about the characters.

Posted by: kelsy at March 7, 2009 2:07 AM

My take on Akerman was less "shitty actress" (though she's not great by any means) and more, well, "boring actress." She got lost entirely in the spectacle of the film, and when put next to Healy, Morgan, even Gugino who, while maybe this wasn't her best performance ever, at least maintained some sort of presence on screen, she just basically disappeared.

While he's still a little green yet, I do believe that Snyder could become a great director. He just keeps taking on such ambitious projects that his flaws are almost mercilessly on display.

Posted by: Mimi at March 7, 2009 2:23 AM

Caught the midnight last night. Was a lot better than I thought it would be. Some of the trailer scenes looked clumsy as hell but translated better within the film.

and I feel I must say it again...

FREAKIN JACKIE EARLE HALEY!!!!!!!

Posted by: Protoguy at March 7, 2009 3:00 AM

Thank you, D.C. I'll pass.

Posted by: Spender at March 7, 2009 3:56 AM

I always thought that Watchmen would be more suited to an adaptation as a television miniseries than a movie. Any thoughts?

Posted by: Mr. West at March 7, 2009 4:41 AM

Shit, if you're going to call out Patrick Wilson and Carla Gugino for their performances, why not Matthew Goode?

Personally, I thought Malin Akerman was the weak link, as did you, whereas pretty much everyone else I've read has placed that title squarely upon his shoulders. I'm curious to know what you think about his performance.

By the way... if you thought Carla Gugino was campy, it's because she played it campy, as Sally Jupiter was intended to be.

Posted by: Definitely Maebe at March 7, 2009 5:35 AM

It was too episodic in nature for the rythmns of cinema and as has already been mentioned, it was never going to capture all the nuances of the book (granted, few adaptations ever do).

Exactly.

Everyone hails Watchmen as truly great literature, which is rarely, if ever, matched on film. Even when the adaptation is genius like To Kill A Mockingbird or Lonesome Dove I don't hear anyone say it exceeded the source material. The odds were very much against Snyder here. I'm mostly interested in the comments of the non-readers here, and they are decidely mixed. Looks like this will be a rental for me (a double feature with Harold and Kumar Go to White Castle. Thanks for the tip, Dan).

Posted by: ed newman at March 7, 2009 6:59 AM

I'm skipping this one and saving my strength for "Last House on the Left" next weekend. 163 minutes is too long for me to sit in a theater, unless I'm getting head or actually being assaulted by a giant blue penis through a good portion of that time.

I'll catch it on DVD.

Food for thought: imagine that radioactive smurf Dr. Manhattan and The Pink Hulk going at it, in a blur of aubergine. Beautiful.

Posted by: The Pink Hulk at March 7, 2009 8:05 AM

Uh, where did you get that idea? The dialogue in the riot scene is taken almost directly from the book, and it's very obvious that Alan Moore considers him to be a frighteningly fascistic character and (along with Rorscach) a sociopath.

And how many sociopathic, fascistic protagonists do you get to include before the reader/viewer is left to conclude that the work itself is sociopathic and fascistic? If that's a faithful adaptation of the source material, then I'm sure I wouldn't like it, either.

Posted by: sansho1 at March 7, 2009 8:25 AM

An ensemble cast film with two good performances was not worth 2.5+ hours of my time. And Wilson's wasn't one of them. Jackie Earle Haley was strong as Rorschach (as interpreted by Snyder), and Jeffrey Dean Morgan captured The Comedian as portrayed in the graphic novel. Otherwise, not so much.

I thought Ozymandias' scenes were the worst in the entire film; much worse than the mother/daughter Silk Spectre "who is the less capable actress" battles or even "battle of the awful voice overs" on Mars.

If that's a faithful adaptation of the source material, then I'm sure I wouldn't like it, either.

It's faithful in that entire lines are taken from the book and some scenes (the death of The Comedian) are visually pulled straight from the book. Otherwise, I have issues accepting this as a faithful adaptation. For one thing, the film lacks the dark humor and wit that permeates much of the graphic novel. I've made my peace with that on my blog.

Posted by: Robert at March 7, 2009 8:52 AM

I don't think I would make a good super hero because I'm not the transcendent type. Most of the time I'm so indifferent about things and I don't have the ability to focus for an extended amount of time. These days the only things I think about are pussy and my ever shrinking 401(k), but I'm not bitter or anything. I've had a good long run and if the end is near for me I shall accept it with a sense of relief.

Posted by: Pookie at March 7, 2009 8:52 AM

And how many sociopathic, fascistic protagonists do you get to include before the reader/viewer is left to conclude that the work itself is sociopathic and fascistic? If that's a faithful adaptation of the source material, then I'm sure I wouldn't like it, either.

The original work is a sort of critique of the whole idea of the superhero, so they are all problematic in their attitude towards power, but Nite Owl and Silk Spectre are a lot more humane than the rest (and Dr. Manhattan is more autistic than sociopathic), and the book also includes some subplots including non-superhero characters that were cut from the movie. Much of the appeal of the book also comes not from the characters but from the ideas that Moore explores and the clever formal games he plays with the comics medium, neither of which really translate to the movie...I also think Zack Snyder definitely upped the fetishization of violence and superheroic power from the book, which in interviews he's said is meant to be intentionally problematic and to make us question our enjoyment of those sorts of scenes, but I don't think he really succeeds in this respect.

Posted by: Jesse M. at March 7, 2009 9:29 AM

Okay, I took the day off work yesterday to see this in IMAX with my college friend that was Rorsharch to my Night Owl when we were in school.

IMHO, anyone who claims to be a fan of the original source material and did NOT like this movie can teabag my nuts. I mean, yeah, you can nitpick the thing to death...and I wasn't nerdly happy with EVERYTHING...but it was better than I thought it'd be and I was hoping for at least "good".

Posted by: Green Lantern at March 7, 2009 9:41 AM

Jesse M., thanks for that explanation.

Posted by: sansho1 at March 7, 2009 10:07 AM

I haven't seen it yet. I wont until next weekend.

I am surprised at what a tizzy the presence of a blue penis has put this "scathy" and "bitchy" crowd into. I thought this place was more mature than that. I suppose a lot of the comments are just an attempt at being witty.

As for the long running time. Yeah, it's long, it sort of had to be. It's dense. It's complicated. Probably could have been, and should have been longer. It's funny how all the people can't sit in a theater for 165 minutes or can't take that much time out their day while they probably spend three times that much time mindlessly browsing the internet. They probably spend more than 165 minutes a day on this site alone. Then again, internet time is a weird thing.

Posted by: ForbiddenDonut at March 7, 2009 10:47 AM

I am so glad you brought up the fact that ackerman is too fucking young for her role. and too skinny too! Laurie Jupiter was an attractive, not necessarily hot, solid bodied older woman. I almost don't want to see the movie based on the Silk Spectre casting alone.

Posted by: snarla at March 7, 2009 11:42 AM

He was Rorshach to your Nite Owl? So he was criminally insane and would often break into your house to steal your beans and sugar cubes? (I missed that in the movie. Individually wrapped sugar cubes.)

Posted by: Optimus Rhyme at March 7, 2009 11:45 AM

Saw it yesterday afternoon. I didn't have a problem with Slow Motion, but in a three hour movie there was definitely TOO MUCH. Seriously: Flipping the pin into the grave in SM? That works... if you haven't already done it eight times already!!!

Seriously, I loved the movie, mostly because of Rorschach. But Snyder needs to learn him some editing skills. Most scenes went on way too long.

And there was enough man-ass in the movie to make me think I was watching a porno... It got to the point that I was checking the sex scenes out to see who's ass got more screen time, his or hers. (his, by a comfortable, if small, margin for the curious...)

Posted by: Spike at March 7, 2009 11:48 AM

Saw the film last night with a friend who haven' t read the GN, read review here and other places, read through commentary (astonishingly civil and pleasing. you guys do rock. Well, was not really funny.)

I agree with the review and comments mostly. It was probably the best adaptation that could have been made.

Blue Penis: Didn't really notice it much. Yeah, it was there, but if you are actually following the story and visuals on screen, it was never a focus. So if you are focusing on that then it shows you are kind of person that puts focus on wrong thing.

Acting: Yeah, Merlin Ackerman was kinda wooden, but really, all in all, not as bad as I dreaded to be. They tried. I mean, they definitely could have hired someone with actual chops, but maybe with all the special effects and etc they just could not afford that. But, you know, RORSCHARCH ROCKED!!!

Credit at the beginning was awesome. I wish the adaptation was made more on that direction through-out. I mean we have 20 years of more tongue-in-cheek historical materials to work on since the source got out.

I think what I had most problem with was over-fetish of Sex and Violence. I read on someone's comment that it was intentional but, really, I thought all the violence scenes were prolonged too much and Sex was more on porn level and not at all sympathetic. It distracted from seeing the characters more and just made them more fantasical and super-heroic and that I think was putting ON the mask than taking it off. Also, it was funny in wrong places.

And I wondered if it would be any point in making it now too, without maybe making it in end of 90's and changing the president to, say, Reagan or George Bush the first, or something. But then a friend mine did think it was relevant, with whole alternate energy and stuff and wanted to read the source. So I guess it did good job in that. Maybe I just had too high a hope?

Like someone else said, I agree this might be a better with TV miniseries. Maybe if the movie and the DVD for Black Freighter and such generates enough buzz they would do a Sc Fi or HBO miniseries (Like they did with Dune) and then they could hire better actors. Or maybe worse actors and worse production...but TV has been pretty good lately, right?

Either way, I'm all for having this story get out there and that more people read the source and whatever adaptation would do that then I'm happy with it. I mean, I did enjoy the film, with the alternated ending and all. The story's strength was still there.

Posted by: yocean at March 7, 2009 11:49 AM

Wow. silk spectre's part was really fed through the stupid machine, wasn't it? Pretty much every other character had heaps more dimension whose demeanors physically and emotionally reflected the lives they'd lived. I can't believe all the other watchmen got to wax poetic and laurie was left with phrases like "that rox" or "awesome."

Posted by: jasper at March 7, 2009 11:53 AM

Dear Captain Chesley Sullenberger,

I applaud you for your heroic act in the face of certain disaster, but please get the fuck off the stage. It has gotten to the point where I can't even turn on the fucking t.v. without seeing your goddamn puss. Go, just go away, anywhere. Scram!!!

There, I said it.

Posted by: Pookie at March 7, 2009 12:40 PM

They did it. They did it.

Raw like sushi. Haters to the left.

Posted by: Jay at March 7, 2009 12:40 PM

I come looking for a hijack thread, and instead get Pookie ranting about a crash landing. I guess that will have to do.

Posted by: Che Grovera at March 7, 2009 12:50 PM

I liked it. Why do I get this feeling people will hate this movie just to hate it? They did a good job - can you imagine the pressure of pandering to the average movie goer AND satisfying the rabid nerds? When you consider how complex the book is I think it's easy to see that this movie is, ultimately, a success because watching the book transferred to the screen gave me chills.

Whoever said this is a movie for the fans are right; I'm a fan and I'm happy with it and I'll be seeing it again.

Posted by: Madz at March 7, 2009 1:07 PM

Che, you and I are mirror images of each other, we both are consumed with our journey inward. We merely tolerate our present circumstances. Though I am somewhat hampered by this mild sexual addiction that I have from reaching my true inner self, but ultimately I will conquer this minor setback and regain my footing. The utopia we seek pales in comparison to the journey we take.

Posted by: Pookie at March 7, 2009 1:19 PM

*gulps down beer*


I'm about halfway down my journey.

Posted by: BarbadoSlim at March 7, 2009 2:03 PM

Saw it with companion yesterday.

I read the novel, and was fairly relieved it wasn't ass-raped. Dan's review title summarizes it perfectly: we didn't need this, but now it's here, it's quite acceptable. I always imagined Doc Manhattan's voice to be deeper & buzzing, but the soothing timbre of Crudup makes sense also.

Company as a layman was intrigued, had a bit of a hard time to follow (sleep deprivation rather than story), still was mesmerized by the overall plot, a bit thrown off by the gorier parts.

Will I recommend this? Like anyone would listen to me.

Posted by: Adere at March 7, 2009 2:29 PM

Companion? Yeah right.

*CqOuUeGeHr*

Posted by: Pookie at March 7, 2009 2:49 PM

I like to leave things open to interpretation.

But Ozzy looked fab in front of 54!

Posted by: Adere at March 7, 2009 3:39 PM

Che, I'm trying hard to promote Seth's "Spoilers" column as this weekend's hijack thread. Stop by and post a spoiler! Thanks!

Posted by: Jerce at March 7, 2009 3:47 PM

I thought this was pretty funny. There's some talk at AfterEllen regarding the lesbian aspects of the book and movie with several people saying "euuugghh, naked men". Ya just can't please everybody!

Posted by: Jay at March 7, 2009 4:21 PM

Didn't read the column yet, will save it for after seeing the film this weekend but props for the title being from Werewolves and Lollipops, from the phenomenal Patton Oswalt....

If you haven't heard it, buy it. #5, The Miracle of Childbirth is where this line comes from and is hilarious.

Posted by: Rubble44 at March 7, 2009 4:25 PM

why do people keep forgetting that as much as Watchmen was about "superheroes", it was about normal people as well ... like the two Bernards, the psychiatrist and his wife, the guy who owns the taxi cab company and his brother, the police, the guy selling the watches on the corner, the lesbian cab driver, etc ... the fact that you get to see them and learn enough about them made the ending so powerful ... and every review I've read about Watchmen seems to forget about this fact ... which means the film forgot about this fact ... which means I will not be watching this piece of shit Zack Snyder served to us on a silver plate.

Posted by: lelnguye at March 7, 2009 6:41 PM

"why do people keep forgetting that as much as Watchmen was about "superheroes", it was about normal people as well ... like the two Bernards, the psychiatrist and his wife, the guy who owns the taxi cab company and his brother, the police, the guy selling the watches on the corner, the lesbian cab driver, etc"

While I agree with you, the movie was already pushing 3 hours, there is no possible way to include those humanizing stories without neglecting the main characters. I'm hoping the director's cut adds in some of those more minor characters, but honestly, some things just have to get cut and for me, Dan and Laurie's story is about as sad and human as you can get.

Posted by: Madz at March 7, 2009 7:05 PM

hold on there, we have yet to see zak's super stupendous cut or whatever.
from what i saw (and even though i hearted), this theatrical version may have been a tad too much all at once. even so.
we'll just have to wait to see if the extended versionS will include say, long's wife or dyke cabbie's chick as well as fleshing out say, hollis or my boyfriend's blue peep.

Posted by: gp at March 7, 2009 7:11 PM

That whackjob woman has a point: they ARE marketing this to kids, and they really shouldn't be.

My husband and I saw this last night -- mostly because we wanted to, but also because out 9 year old son has been hammering us about seeing it himself, and now we have the unenviable task of breaking it to him: Sorry, kiddo, this is definitely NOT a kid movie. You'll have to trust us, of course, because the way they've been advertising it, you really believe it IS a kid's movie... but it ain't. And you'll have nightmares if we let you see it... that is, if you manage to sit through the whole thing without skeeving out over the blue penis that keeps popping up everywhere.

DUDE. A few shots of blue cock is fine. Seriously, the first couple were cool; after all, it makes total sense. And hey -- the Doc is hung in total proportion to the rest of his rockin' azure bod. But after a while.. what the FUCK.

After a while, it's not the cock that's a distraction... it's wondering what the FUCK is up with the director and his complete and utter obsession with all things male-body-oriented? Just how many beautifully sculpted male bodies are we going to be treated to in Snyder films? How many plot points will be sacrificed to the altar of rock hard abs and glutes? Jesus fucking Hussein Christ, man!

I digress. (It's contagious.) The blue cock is NOT what's really going to keep me from allowing my 9 year old son from seeing Watchmen. I think it was the fourteenth compound fracture in slow motion. Or maybe it was the graphic almost-rape. Yeah. Might have been that. Or the chainsawed hands. Or the dogs gnawing the murdered little girl's leg.

So, while I'm sure that shrieking christofascist woman and I have virtually nothing else in common -- including taste in films, because while I have MANY problems with Watchmen, many of which have been dealt with by the commenters here quite handily (ACKERMAN! Ack!), I didn't run screaming from the theatre in disgust. It was... okay. My ass hurt, because the director is a self-indulgent douchebag who doesn't know that the over-2 hour film should be the VERY GREAT EXCEPTION to the rule and that he has not EARNED THE RIGHT to that exception... And the many many broken bones scenes really annoyed me. But it was an okay flick...

Anyway -- while I'm sure that banshee and I have very little else in common, I have to agree with her about the whole "They're marketing this to kids and they sure as hell shouldn't be" thing. Yeah, it's rated "R." And yeah, we all know how much of a deterrent that is to those mouthbreathing asswipes out there who'd rather pay the kiddie movie ticket prices than an actual babysitter.

As the great Keanu Reeves said in Parenthood: "You need a license to buy a dog. You need a license to catch a FISH. But they'll let any butt-reamin' asshole be a father." Proof available at any multiplex screening Watchmen, where said butt-reaming assholes are currently bringing their way-too-young kids to every showing.

Posted by: Maryscott O'Connor at March 7, 2009 7:38 PM

I'm confused...what about this is being marketed to kids? I am honestly curious, and am hoping that this isn't simply another case of "well it's a comic book movie, so of course it's for kida!" type thinking.

I mean, you can't blame the filmmakers if some yahoo can't figure out an R-rated movie might not be the best place to take kids.

I am just glad nobody did that at the showing I went to.

Posted by: Vermillion at March 7, 2009 7:53 PM

Hey guess what there's an easy way to check beforehand if this is okay for kids. Read the fucking comic book. Ta-DA within the first ten or so pages you know this is not for kids. Case closed.

Oh and that big R rating. I think that might be a hint, too. Don't blame the movie, seriously, as an adult I wish MORE comic book movies were R and actually aimed at adults.

Also I love people freaking out over male nudity. Get over yourself.

Posted by: Madz at March 7, 2009 8:01 PM

There's nothing wrong with long movies if the story warrants length, I don't think you have to earn the right to tell a long story. I appreciate richness and ambition. It wasn't a secret that it was longer than two hours though, and I don't see where this phantom "kids marketing" is. One could say "The Dark Knight" did, but is there a Burker King Archie toy I don't know about?

Posted by: Jay at March 7, 2009 8:14 PM

Yeah, MSO - where is this supposed marketing to kids? I'm not seeing it. People keep making the claim, and not backing it up. If it's happening and someone shows me, than that's one thing. But it's not like this is being advertised during Saturday morning cartoons, or they're showing trailers on Nickelodeon. Just because they show the trailer during prime time on NBC, doesn't mean it's being marketed to kids. And just because there are action figures, doesn't mean that either. The action figures you see pictures of are usually found in comic book and collectible shops, not Toys R Us.

Posted by: I Love Beets at March 7, 2009 8:24 PM

Marketed for kids? What?

The movie is rated "R". If you had bothered to read either the graphic novel or any of the dozens and dozens of reviews that were available prior to the film's release you would have known that the movie was very, very violent and there was a brutal rape scene.

I wouldn't let a 9 year old read that comic book and sure wouldn't let him/her see the film.

Don't get all pissed off at Snyder because you took your son to see an inappropriate film. My parents took me to see "R" rated flicks by when I was that age, but they always, /always/ had seen them first.

Live and learn, I suppose.

Posted by: ForbiddenDonut at March 7, 2009 8:25 PM

as someone who loves the graphic novel and is almost a painful purist when it comes to film adaptations, I was going into this movie with large reservations. While the film did not wow me, I didn't leave fuming. Snyder did his best to make a movie that is quite frankly impossible to make. it's way to complex, every detail, every side character's story is important to the overall message of the novel, and in a movie these characters were often pushed to the side or trivialized for a quick scene. Also I left angry that the movie made complex characters almost completely one-sided by only showing one aspect of their character rather than showing the whole picture, an issue I had with the Comedian. Because I knew his character well from the novel I was always sympathetic towards him the movie, but I wandered if movie goers who had not read Watchmen would be because they only showed him being a monster, and now enough of him trying to speak to his daughter. And Malin Akerman did not even act angry when the Comedian died as she did in the novel, making me confused when she was so disgusted to find out he was her father. They left too much out, but they kept overly long actions and sec sequences, that were often times violent for the sake of violence, and sickening.

Posted by: Person at March 7, 2009 8:46 PM

I love the book and find it more nourishing to the wizened, skeptic soul.

The movie tried to update and skim over all the literary and mystical weight of the book.

And I Loved It.

Also queued for its March 24 release, the comic book within the comic book, Black Freighter.

I dug Dawn of the Dead, hated all but the special effects of 300, but I might start gushing if I say any more about Watchmen.

The twin origin trailers for Wolverine and Star Trek didn't look so bad. Trailers are much easier to make than movies. I want to hate Star Trek as I'm of the Jedi persuasion, but it appears as if all hope is not lost. They really should just reboot all the names. The trailer totally tries to sell us on the legend of James Tyberius Kirk. It's when Uhuru and Sulu and Simon Pegg as Scottie enter the picture that makes me vomit. Oh, and fuck Tyler Perry. Unless the Starship Enterprise's mission is to wipe that Medea stain from the universe, I'm still not seeing that movie. It'll all come down to how audacious they are in rebooting Star Trek.

Wolverine just looks badass. I hope they can make it R and I really hope the Magneto origins movie can be even better. I hope that movie signals an X-men reboot. I hate all those movies except for the make-up done for Nightcrawler.

Posted by: Jackseppelin at March 7, 2009 8:56 PM

Okay, folks, I understand your defensiveness, but it isn't fair to jump down Maryscott's or anyone else's throat about this "marketing to kids" thing.

Truth is, different places get different marketing. Maybe there is indeed some jackass exec who thought that a commercial for this movie would be nice to put on after Spongebob. I can only speak for my area, and I really don't watch much live TV, so I was curious if this was the case.

And it has been said that many of us did see R-rated films as children, with no ill effects (well, none that bad). But some parents would rather avoid that, which is what I was reading in her post (and even the crazy lady's rantings). I just wanted to make sure that it isn't another case of Jack Thompson-like simplistic thinking. On its face, it is a comic book movie with some action figures and (if I remember correctly) a video game tie-in. Batman Begins and The Dark Knight had these as well.

Is it impossible that Watchmen is being marketed to kids? No. Is it likely? Not really. Is it an actuality? That is what I want to know.

Posted by: Vermillion at March 7, 2009 9:32 PM

It's "wiles," you illiterate halfwit. Not "wilds." If you're going to spout off incoherent nonsense, at least get the goddamn words right.

Posted by: I Love Beets at March 5, 2009 3:25 PM
________________________________________________________________________


It's "conscience," dumbfuck. Not "conscious."

For fuck's sake, Pookie, try to get ONE thing right, just for a fucking change of pace if nothing else.

Posted by: I Love Beets at March 6, 2009 3:05 PM
________________________________________________________________________

Oh, fucking please. Don't make promises you're not going to keep, Pookie. You know you'll still wander around this place, growing on people like cancer for some inexplicable reason.

Oh, and it's "ensure", asshole.

Posted by: I Love Beets at March 7, 2009 4:38 PM
________________________________________________________________________

Yeah, MSO - where is this supposed marketing to kids? I'm not seeing it. People keep making the claim, and not backing it up. If it's happening and someone shows me, than that's one thing. But it's not like this is being advertised during Saturday morning cartoons, or they're showing trailers on Nickelodeon. Just because they show the trailer during prime time on NBC, doesn't mean it's being marketed to kids. And just because there are action figures, doesn't mean that either. The action figures you see pictures of are usually found in comic book and collectible shops, not Toys R Us.

Posted by: I Love Beets at March 7, 2009 8:24 PM
________________________________________________________________________

"If it's happening and someone shows me, than that's one thing."

Excuse me I Love Beets, but I think you meant to say "If it's happening and someone shows me, "then" that's one thing." instead you wrote "than," I'm not trying to be an asshole by pointing out an obvious mistake, but since you are such a stickler when it comes to spelling and grammar I thought I would bring it to your attention. Because only a complete asshole would try and make hay with a person's unintentional mistake, and I know you are not such a person.

Posted by: Pookie at March 7, 2009 9:39 PM

Vermillion, I agree with you that by its very nature, a comic book movie might be aimed at kids. But in reality, it's always, always a parent's responsibility to know what they're taking their kid to. I have not seen any direct marketing towards kids for this movie. The trailers are gritty and show people being blown up; that's a pretty big hint right there.

The action figures are for nerdy collectors and aren't being sold at any fastfood places as part of happy meals or whatever. I loved the Dark Knight, but even I think it's reprehensible that it got a PG13 rating and parents brought their little kids to watch a psychotic killer and Harvey Dent with his face destroyed.

I know we all have mixed feelings about Watchmen, but I want to bring up one important point that I haven't seen anyone mention yet:

This movie is a wonderful achievement if only because it's actually being made. I think it says something about our social climate that we can have a movie come out with a big opening weekend and that movie contains philosophies and questions that are hard to deal with. Just think of how many annoying romcoms and mindless action flicks come out every year - this movie signifies a willingness to push the boundaries of a genre that has, by and large, been very static. I applaud Zack Snyder for trying and for making a movie that isn't perfect but is very, very good and definitely entertaining.

Posted by: Madz at March 7, 2009 9:40 PM

I found myself on the Pottstown Pike (I believe that was its name) today, on the way to a bridal shower, and as I looked up at an overpass, I saw this graffiti: "Who Watches the Watchmen?" It made me happy. Good, bad, worst movie ever, doesn't matter to me - I'm happy to have a reason to go to the movie theater again, to have something to look forward to seeing!

Posted by: Melissa at March 7, 2009 10:03 PM

I've been following this for awhile and saw the midnight showing. While I agree largely with this review, in snyder's defense, he shot the movie as a three and a half hour epic and had to cut out an hour for the theatrical cut. There is a three hour, ten minute directors cut coming out with another forty minutes of plot and sidestories cut back in and then the three hour twenty-five minute ultimate edition with the fifteen minutes of black freighter and newsstand footage edited back in as well. Unfortunately, the theatrical release shows the enherent pacing issues of this which fucks up the tone of whole movie as well. Whole character archs are cut or removed from the feature, which are what made the book great in the first place. So, knowing this, I have to reserve full judgement on this movie because there were so many great moments left in even with the neutering that I believe Snyder got it right in the end. Warners really should have gone the Kill Bill route on this one. They may have buried themselves by doing it this way.

Posted by: Smatt584 at March 7, 2009 10:11 PM

While I agree with you, the movie was already pushing 3 hours, there is no possible way to include those humanizing stories without neglecting the main characters. I'm hoping the director's cut adds in some of those more minor characters, but honestly, some things just have to get cut and for me, Dan and Laurie's story is about as sad and human as you can get.

I'm in no way a purist and I really don't mind material being cut. the Black Freighter stuff had to be cut because it couldn't translate ... but these "sideline" characters were what drove the message home ... as human as Dan and Laurie are (... and, by the way, I just don't see how they can capture the emotion of Laurie and Jon's debate in Mars ... which is another problem I have with the movie), they're still alien from you because they're "masks". Dan is a billionaire and Laurie is the daughter of an ex-mask ... how many of us can relate to that?

the Bernards, the police, the psychiatrist, etc ... spoilers, by the way they're normal people and we see how the existence of heroes affects them in small ways (the cigarettes and the fashion) and major ways ( Manhattan leaving the earth and leaving the U.S. vulnerable to attack, Nixon still being president, Adrian's plan) end spoilers ... for me, they're what made the ending devastating. if the movie managed to capture that, then I wouldn't have a problem with it ... but every review I've read suggests otherwise

it's the same problem I had with From Hell and V for Vendetta ... the adaptations kept the visuals and tried to keep the basic structure of the comics ... but they threw everything that made the stories good out ... and that would be okay if they replaced it with equally good ideas, like how "Blade Runner" is just as good as "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep", but they don't ... From Hell became a really shitty whodunit while V for Vendetta became a Micahel Moore film.

beyond that, I also have a problem with the cast ... Matthew Goode in particular seems like a bad choice. aside from the fact that he's a terrible actor and will probably end up becoming the next Hugh Grant, all of his interviews seem to suggest he did not understand Ozymandias or the comic. this would be fine if the film was not trying to do something different, but not so much if you're trying to be "loyal" to the material.

sorry ... I'm not getting laid tonight so I go on the internet to rave about comic books ... I could go on and on and on and on and on ...

Posted by: lelnguye at March 7, 2009 10:25 PM

Or, to use a gruesome and overly dramatic metaphor, what would you do if you had to cut a third off of your child? Which parts could you do without and still be left with a decent life? Snyder deserves credit just for being able to create a serviceable movie under these guidelines, but only time will tell if the extended is the masterpiece that we all want it to be.

Posted by: Smatt584 at March 7, 2009 10:31 PM

Speaking of not understanding the comic, apparently, lelnguye, you were smoking crack the last time you read the comic because Dan isn't a billionaire. He inherited money from his banker father. That doesn't make him Rupert Murdoch. He and Laurie are still the most human elements of the story - Jon's story is treated with incredible tenderness in the movie and the sequence when he recalls his former life/transformation on Mars if unbelievably well done. You see a man who was once living a happy, fulfilling life and an accident strips him of everything that made him happy and allowed him to feel. That's pretty damn human to me.

I like that you say you aren't a "purist" and then go on to prove that you absolutely are. Ozymandias isn't a "deep" character, he's a selfish, insane, egotistical maniac and that's exactly what we see in the film. Even -he- is humanized when we see his reflecting and possible doubts about what he's done as Laurie and Dan leave his ice base.

I'd also argue that the "normal people" in the comic are not really what make the ending devastating, but I suppose that's a matter of opinion.

Posted by: Madz at March 7, 2009 10:34 PM

Anybody else think maskless Rorschach looked like Danny Bonaduce fucked Martin Short?

And I thought Nixon's nose could've been bigger.

Posted by: Andrew at March 7, 2009 11:21 PM

well, I was going to sleep but ... spoilers galore, be warned

Speaking of not understanding the comic, apparently, lelnguye, you were smoking crack the last time you read the comic because Dan isn't a billionaire. He inherited money from his banker father. That doesn't make him Rupert Murdoch.

uhm ... the point was Dan was incredibly rich ... you'd have to be to afford a gym, an entire apartment complex, an abandoned building ... and not to mention a shitload of gadgets and a ship that fires missiles, is radar-invisible ... etc ... and yes, he may have inherited it, but that doesn't make him any less rich ... so yeah, I'd say billionaire is a pretty good description ... and nowhere did I compare him to Rupert Murdoch in my original post

I like that you say you aren't a "purist" and then go on to prove that you absolutely are. Ozymandias isn't a "deep" character, he's a selfish, insane, egotistical maniac and that's exactly what we see in the film. Even -he- is humanized when we see his reflecting and possible doubts about what he's done as Laurie and Dan leave his ice base.

actually, if you read what I wrote, you'll realize that I don't really care. I enjoyed "Blade Runner" and "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep", I enjoyed the first two X-Men movies, even with all the changes and I found the film version of "Road to Perdition" enjoyable ... I don't care that they didn't include the squid or that the black freighter wasn't included ... and I don't care if they changed the story completely and made it about Rorsarch and Nite Owl playing pong ... all of that wouldn't irk me so much if it was done well, but from what I've seen and what I've read, that doesn't seem to be the case.

as for Ozymandias, I will agree that he is a megalomaniac ... but his "humanization" comes from the fact that he *is* how Alan Moore wrote him. not a "republic serial villain", but someone with actual thoughts and emotions. now, forgive me for actually thinking this, but I think that qualifies him as complex.

I'd also argue that the "normal people" in the comic are not really what make the ending devastating, but I suppose that's a matter of opinion.

we can argue about this point forever, and we'll still end up thinking the other is an asshole. so, let's leave it at that. I've made my argument, and you have your opinion, so there ...





... but I'm still right ...

Posted by: lelnguye at March 7, 2009 11:26 PM

I agree with nearly everyone that this was way too long. Actually, I fell asleep a little near the end (but I'm six months pregnant so that'l happen) and when I woke up and checked my watch there was still another half hour to go. Really, I think you can only get away with that kind of length if your build UP the intensity and edit it to keep the narrative flowing fast enough so it SEEMS short. This film kind of did the opposite. It actually started out great. I thought the opening credit/backstory sequence was very well-done and emotionally evocative the way the rest of the film just wasn't. This either needed to be edited better or made into some kind of miniseries, like on HBO. I liked Jackie Earl Hayley's performance quite a bit, and Billy Crudup, Patrick Wilson and the other guy fine as well. The women needed to be a little stronger, I think. Something missing there. I guess my favorite part was the Dr. Manhattan backstory, beautifully choreographed to music from Koyaanisqatsi. Still, not exactly worth the price of admission. Kind of made me want to watch Koyaanisqatsi again, actually.

Posted by: Dagmar at March 7, 2009 11:35 PM

I agree with nearly everyone that this was way too long. Actually, I fell asleep a little near the end (but I'm six months pregnant so that'l happen) and when I woke up and checked my watch there was still another half hour to go. Really, I think you can only get away with that kind of length if your build UP the intensity and edit it to keep the narrative flowing fast enough so it SEEMS short. This film kind of did the opposite. It actually started out great. I thought the opening credit/backstory sequence was very well-done and emotionally evocative the way the rest of the film just wasn't. This either needed to be edited better or made into some kind of miniseries, like on HBO. I liked Jackie Earl Hayley's performance quite a bit, and Billy Crudup, Patrick Wilson and the other guy fine as well. My husband read the book and said the Osmanthius character was cast all wrong, and that guy seemed pretty weak to me, too. The women needed to be a little stronger, I think. Something missing there. I guess my favorite part was the Dr. Manhattan backstory, beautifully choreographed to music from Koyaanisqatsi. Still, not exactly worth the price of admission. Kind of made me want to watch Koyaanisqatsi again, actually.

Posted by: Dagmar at March 7, 2009 11:37 PM

Sorry about double post! How'd that happen?

Posted by: Dagmar at March 7, 2009 11:39 PM

Contains spoilers, and I don't care.

This is an awful film. That's really all there is to it. It's a film that never actually starts and neeeeeever ends. All of it is backstory. I was expecting it to end with an Ironman-esque epilogue, teasing of the great confrontation to come in the sequel, but no. The backstory kept going, and suddenly we have an end to the film that pretends to have weight and moral complexity. 'Cause you know, it's the struggle between capitalism and communism that was the only source of conflict in the entire world. Once the superpowers kiss and make up, there can never be any bad things in the world, ever. Nuclear holocaust justified, and we can all go home.

This is not an intelligent, complex, philosophical film. That it was made in the first place proves only that you can get any old rubbish funded if it includes explosions and gratuitous sex scenes in the sky. If the original comic had any actual narrative merit then great, but the film has none.

Laurie Whatzerface is dreadful - you live with a magical shiny blue man who is gradually losing any bonds he once had to the human race and the concept of carbon-based life altogether, and when it's your turn to try to convince him to save the planet all you can do is huff and pout as if he was Joe Slob refusing to do the dishes? And "sucking your fingers is like licking a battery"? For the love of Zeus...

Oh, and if there is someone out to off ex-masked superheroes, how safe do you think it would be to discuss your secret identities and past crime-fighting capers at the local diner? Very, apparantly.

Also, I intensely dislike watching "supeheroes" who are dumber than me. Was it really that hard to figure out who mister big bad guy was? Besides, what evil mastermind leaves the password to his top secret plan just sitting there on the desk? Or doesn't have burglar alarms in his office? And what was with the snow leopard-antilope creature?

Rorscach was a sadistic sociopathic creep, and he was the most likable of them all. His ten-year-old self ripping the flesh off a school bully's face with his teeth was perhaps the msot emotionally compelling and credible instance of the entire film.

In short: It was lazy and lame. I want my money and my three hours back.

Posted by: Spongie at March 7, 2009 11:54 PM

where is this being marketed to kids???

in the VERY 1ST TEASER TRAILER, the VERY 1ST 15 seconds of footage any of us EVER saw, a vietcong soilder was BLOWN THE FUCK UP.
any, and i mean EACH AND EVERY parent who thought, nice, let's make it a family night, well i mean for the love of all common sense...3

there was a little girl no older than 9 or 10 a few seats down from me in the theater. during the almost-rape, she freaked, audibly. did her parents take her out? did they cut their loses and leave?
nope. they SHUSHED her.

fucking idiots.

Posted by: gp at March 7, 2009 11:54 PM

a genetically-altered lynx.
whom i *HEART*

Posted by: gp at March 8, 2009 12:02 AM

I was expecting it to end with an Ironman-esque epilogue, teasing of the great confrontation to come in the sequel, but no.

That was your first mistake. Not saying you were wrong for wanting that, just that the book was not about such things. Besides, what would exactly happen in this big confrontation? Manhattan said it himself: he has no fear anymore, because he is so powerful. He is Superman taken to the logical extreme. So we take him out of the equation, and all you have are the other heroes, and they had their confrontation in this film. There is nothing left to punch.

There is a reason why those familiar with the story (even Snyder himself) were so amused and skeptical when folks started talking about sequels: there simply is no real reason to make one. The story is pretty much complete.

'Cause you know, it's the struggle between capitalism and communism that was the only source of conflict in the entire world. Once the superpowers kiss and make up, there can never be any bad things in the world, ever.

Again, if you thought that was what the movie (or the book) was about, you missed the point entirely. The nuclear war stuff was a MacGuffin (much like the Comedian's murder, as someone said above). As far as the ending, it was always left as a mystery. If the reader/viewer wanted to believe it worked, then it did. If not, then it didn't. Just like the characters and their motivations, it was all in your perception.

Nuclear holocaust justified, and we can all go home.

That sentence, I don't think it means what you think it means.

Oh, and if there is someone out to off ex-masked superheroes, how safe do you think it would be to discuss your secret identities and past crime-fighting capers at the local diner? Very, apparantly.

Silk Spectre was publicly known as the girlfriend of Dr. Manhattan, and her mother was also very public about her identity. And Nite Owl appeared to be just some shlub at most. Both were long retired, and neither were wanted by the law (unlike Rorshach). And do you really listen to other people's conversations while you are out to dinner?

Of course, until Snyder's actual vision comes out, I hold myself from judging too harshly.

Posted by: Vermillion at March 8, 2009 12:19 AM

Ozymandias isn't a "deep" character, he's a selfish, insane, egotistical maniac and that's exactly what we see in the film.

SPOILERS, obviously:

If you thought Ozymandias was an pure villain, I kind of think you missed the point--Alan Moore did plenty in the comic to make his actions ambiguous, and to raise the serious possibility that he was actually a kind of hero. One thing Moore did was to portray him as being amazingly good at projecting the future behavior of society as a whole (almost like the 'psychohistorians' in Asimov's Foundation trilogy), so that the reader could infer he actually had a sound basis for being confident that nuclear war was inevitable if he didn't do something to prevent it; this was set up with things like his earlier uncanny ability to predict the mood of consumers by watching his wall of televisions on p. 8 of chapter X, by Rorschach's observation of the chart showing "global population...nuclear hazard escalation index...environmental decline...mulitple crisis graph, converging mid 1990s" on p. 19, and by the part of his monologue about the death spiral of East and West on p. 21-22 of chapter XI (where he also mentioned that he was able to predict in advance that costumed heroes would be outcasts by the late seventies). This was followed at the bottom of p. 22 by some sentiments which I think are meant to be genuinely heartfelt about why he feels nuclear war is so horrifying (and which probably reflect Moore's own horror at the idea--see the section from 4:40 - 6:40 in this interview where Moore talks about how his real-life fear of nuclear war was one of the primary inspirations for the story)...I'll quote that section of Ozymandias' speech here:

Each step had to be taken carefully, constantly striving to keep in mind the enormous scale of what was at stake! The Earth. Humanity. All we've ever known..."end of the world" does the concept no justice. The world's present would end. Its future, immeasurably vaster, would also vanish. Even our past would be cancelled. Our struggle from the primal ooze, every childbirth, every personal sacrifice rendered meaningless, leading only to dust, tossed on the void-winds. Save for Richard Nixon, whose name adorns a plaque upon the moon, no human vestige would remain. Ruins become sand, sand blows away...all our richness and color and beauty would be lost...as if it had never been.

To me, all of this stuff makes Ozymandias' motivations a lot more sympathetic and his actions more morally ambiguous, and also makes it seem that his later tears are at least somewhat tears of joy at saving the human race as opposed to just egomaniacal happiness at the fact that everything had gone as he had planned. Whereas in the movie, Ozymandias isn't shown to have any more reason than the average Joe for thinking nuclear war is inevitable, so it seems far more like a maniacal exercise in self-aggrandizement that he brings the world to the brink and then stops the war himself by killing a few million people. The other problem with the end in the movie is that Snyder doesn't keep the apocalyptic nature of the story present in the viewer's mind through that looong middle section about Dan and Laurie's personal issues and Rorschach being in prison...there are a few scenes with Nixon in the Strangelove war room that illustrate the danger is present from a plot perspective, but these scenes are too silly to carry any emotional weight, whereas in the book the threat is presented in a much more realistic way through discussions by regular characters like the newsvendors and news reports constantly shown in the background on TVs and newspapers, so for me it was really a sort of cathartic moment to see how Ozymandias' plan had "cut the gordian knot" and stopped this seemingly unstoppable march towards the apocalypse.

Posted by: Jesse M. at March 8, 2009 12:23 AM

Another point about the "talking superheroics in the diner" problem: at that point in the story, neither one of them believed there was a mask-killer. So why would they be looking out for one?

Posted by: Vermillion at March 8, 2009 12:23 AM

Vermillion, I can quite happily accept that the comic doesn't need a sequel, and that is the best thing since sliced bread etc. I just don't think the fact that the original text is supposed to be fantastosuperrific should be considered a mitigating factor when reviewing the film (not that you're necessarily doing that - although you do refer to the reader/viewer as if their experiences were equal...).

My point is that the film was very wishy-washy about when it actually began, and since it was long as sin before Rorsach and Dan even figure out what's going on I just could not see the one film being able to deliver a suitable ending - and hey, I was right. The film was simply uneven and messy.

And do you really listen to other people's conversations while you are out to dinner?

Of course, since it wouldn't be *nice* to eavesdrop on people, nobody would, not even the bad guys! Incidentally, I *do* listen to other people's conversations whenever possible. Of course, I pretend not to. I'm a decent person, after all... :-)

Posted by: Spongie at March 8, 2009 12:37 AM

I just saw the movie, and I'm really happy. I thought it was going to blow, even after the reviews I read, but it was a damn good (not great, don't misinterpret me) film. Watchmen really shouldn't have been made into a movie, but it was inevitable that it would happen, because Hollywood has no ideas, so they had to make it in the best possible way they could. This film did just that, and I applaud Watchmen for that achievement.

Now, to comment on the comments.

Maryscott O'Connor, the "R" rating dispels the idea that the film is marketing to kids. If you can't see that, you really need to focus more on the details of life. The film didn't bullshit us on its content and bribe the MPAA like The Dark Knight (a great film) or Titanic (A good, but not great film, I want to hate it, but I just can't hate it. Watchmen's better.) It was perfectly honest about it's content, and the only reason anyone would think it was being marketed to kids would be the sheer volume to which it was being marketed.

Smatt584, I completely disagree with the volume idea, that would have shot the film in the foot. If it was in volumes, the first one would have had no climax, and the second one would have been too confusing. The ideal route would be a four hour film with an intermission, but Hollywood, for reasons of profit, has gotten rid of intermissions. I hate them for that, some films I really like (Lord of the Rings) would have been much better with an intermission.

But the truth is, even though it shouldn't have been made, Watchmen was made in the best possible way, except for that idiot who played Silk Specter. Also, I've never been happier to see a penis onscreen. I thought they would bullshit that by giving Manhattan underwear, or blurring it out, but his glorious blue penis was onscreen. The film censored nothing, and I love it for that.

Watchmen's not for everyone, but it was for me, and I liked how they handled it. The people in Hollywood are a bunch of unoriginal sellouts who will turn anything into a film, regardless if it's a good idea: But those unoriginal sellouts did this bad idea right.

I'd also like to give a shout out to Daniel Carlson for the title. And to those con artists at Hollywood for casting actual actors (Robert Downey Jr., Heath Ledger, and, as of right now, Jackie Earl Haley) into comic book movies.

Have a nice day.

Posted by: George at March 8, 2009 12:46 AM

I just don't think the fact that the original text is supposed to be fantastosuperrific should be considered a mitigating factor when reviewing the film (not that you're necessarily doing that - although you do refer to the reader/viewer as if their experiences were equal...).

Unfortunately, with it being an adaptation, I kinda have to compare the two experiences. The very act of adaptation demands that the two be compared, contrasted, and considered. Plus, it was clear form the beginning that Snyder was focusing more on accuracy than accessibility; those who had read the original source would get more out of it than a layman, especially with the chunks of material removed.

My point is that the film was very wishy-washy about when it actually began, and since it was long as sin before Rorsach and Dan even figure out what's going on I just could not see the one film being able to deliver a suitable ending - and hey, I was right. The film was simply uneven and messy.

See, here is where I have to hold my judgment until the extended release comes out. The story is just so dense that just about any cuts made would make it unwieldy. I think that if this is what Snyder managed as a partial version, then his original attempt may be better. It is easier to build up than whittle down.

It still sounds like you were expecting something a bit more traditional than what you saw, as evidenced by your mention of wanting to see an "Ironman-esque epilogue". If you were expecting a clear-cut good vs. evil story with a satisfying conclusion, then you were definitely going to be disappointed.

Posted by: Vermillion at March 8, 2009 1:00 AM

I've never read the source material but I'm going to after seeing the movie. Spoongie, if you think this is about communism vs. capitalism you've certainly missed the point completely. It's about morality and ethics, us vs. them mentality, and human nature when constrained, encouraged or free from governmental oversight. It's about ambiguity - the gray interstices of life. Just look at what happens to Rorschach, the only character that perceives life in black and white.

And about the male nudity, for me, I'm just glad that finally we get some that's treated like no big deal (as it should be) after constantly viewing gratuitous breasts in movie after movie.

Posted by: Sharopa at March 8, 2009 1:17 AM

Vermillion,

I don't necessarily need clear-cut good-vs-evil, but of course, having not known anything about the story beyond "it's a comic adaptation" I definitely did not know what to expect. I'm a layman with no emotional investment in the original, and I have no intention to give the director the benefit of the doubt and put myself through a longer director's cut just in case it's better - but I can appreciate that some might. I maintain that for me, without said emotional investment and hope of salvation in a longer edit, the film sucked.

Our disagreements on the film are really down to different approaches to what the film or an adaptation more broadly is/should be, whether the director's vision in face of studio pressure should count as a redeeming feature etc.

Posted by: Spongie at March 8, 2009 1:30 AM

I have something for youuuuu....*slap slap slap slap*

Posted by: admin at March 8, 2009 1:30 AM

Do I move my clock backwards or forwards? I'm sleepy, my nuts hurt.

Posted by: Pookie at March 8, 2009 1:36 AM

Can I just say that I wanted to punch babies when they started the whole sex scene in the owl mobile. God damnit, how fucking unremarkable was that?!

I want my money and time back.

Posted by: tallulahc at March 8, 2009 3:00 AM

Sharopa,

I get what the film was trying to be, I just don't think it was very good at it.

After the cities are destroyed the superheroes more or less agree it is the morally appropriate thing for Manhattan to be considered globally evil. Much like Harvey has to die the hero and Batman has to be evil so the city can have some hope. Oh, how deep and meaningful. Is that what I'm supposed to have not "got"? If, on top of that, the film was supposed to have a critical commentary, it's own semi-Brechtian "oh how deep and meaningful"-jibe at its own contrivances at the end, then that's what I didn't get.

What I thought was cheap and sloppy was how the superheroes seem to accept Nixon's televised address as evidence that now peace truly will reign. You can't deny that the US and the USSR uniting at the end of the film isn't presented as the start of global peace. Perhaps my criticism about the film - exactly the point that the world's conflicts aren't reducible to capitalism/communism, that the solution the Watchmen come up with is painfully naive - is supposed to also be implicit in the film text itself, perhaps my righteous anger is supposed to be with the film and not at it, but that's not how it played out to me.

Posted by: Spongie at March 8, 2009 3:00 AM

Pookie, you move your clock witchever way you want to, the rest of the world shall follow.

Posted by: admin at March 8, 2009 3:06 AM

Alright, why the hell is everyone bitching about the bouncing blue cock of Dr. Manhattan?

Nobody bitches and complains when there are tits bouncing on screen...

Posted by: annoyingmouse at March 8, 2009 3:18 AM

Perhaps my criticism about the film - exactly the point that the world's conflicts aren't reducible to capitalism/communism, that the solution the Watchmen come up with is painfully naive

Ah, see, there's the rub. You seem to be under the impression that the endgame was to fix all the world's ills. It wasn't. No one was naive enough to think the world's problems were that simple.

The whole plot wasn't to "fix" society, but to allow it to survive long enough to heal itself. It wasn't about stopping corruption, but halting extinction. It was never seen as a permanent fix, but as a way to buy time. There was no chance for humanity to focus on solving their numerous problems if everyone was scared shitless and ready for the bombs to drop and destroy everything. The plan was to end that particular threat, and give the superpowers something else to focus on instead of nuclear armageddon.

As someone mentioned above, that aspect wasn't really focused on in the film.

Posted by: Vermillion at March 8, 2009 3:20 AM

*sigh*

Did I miss bucdaddy's question for the open thread?

(I'm trying to avoid reading comment relevant to the review as I assume they may contain *spoilers*).

You're not helping Verm.

Posted by: admin at March 8, 2009 3:28 AM

Sorry, admin, but you should have taken into account that I wasn't going to go that easy on the geekiness.

Posted by: Vermillion at March 8, 2009 3:32 AM

Ok, but seriously, if I edited all the footage of blue superhuman cock together, it would be about 1/2 an hour of the movie. There's a lot of blue cock. A lot.

...scuse me a minute....
*buzzzzzzzz*

Posted by: popejenn at March 8, 2009 3:33 AM

Pookie, after saying you didn't think I Love Beets was worth the effort to respond to, you go cut and past comments from different threads into one comment of a movie review. Wow, that's commitment. After all that effort, you're still wrong. "If it's happening and someone shows me, than that's one thing." is acceptable usage.

I'm not writing out of spite or anything. You remind me of a friend from school who just loved saying randomly offensive stuff just to piss people off and get attention. But then was surprisingly hurt when people thought he was a shithead for it and told him so.

Posted by: Than vs. Then at March 8, 2009 3:39 AM

I know Verm. But, for the first time in my life, I am actually virginal when it comes to this particular situation. I have the graphic novel on my bedstand and I intend to read it, after I see the movie. I'm trying to avoid dissapointment.

Posted by: admin at March 8, 2009 3:48 AM

Now I see why many thought Watchmen was unfilmable. The book's themes are just too deep, too diffuse to be pinned down onscreen. What's dramatic and moving on the page carries zero emotional resonance in Snyder's hands.

He did what he could...the flashbacks do a pretty decent job of fleshing out character motivation...however during the last hour Snyder loses the thread. (SPOILER TIME AT THE APOLLO)...Laurie and Jon's conversation on Mars when she discovers the truth about Comedian, the Veidt reveal, Rorschach's death along with the deaths of countless millions...those sequences should have carried the most dramatic weight but instead fall strangely flat.

Posted by: stryker1121 at March 8, 2009 4:14 AM

I took my kids to this movie. I didn't have a sitter and am not squeamish about my kids being exposed to violence, mainly because I make sure my children understand the difference between fantasy and reality. I did, however, cover their eyes for the attempted rape of Silk Spectre I and the Nite Owl II/Silk Spectre II sex scene (which seemed slightly gratuitous).

I thought the blue penis was awesome, mainly because I loved the thought of Generation Homophobe being forced to stare at it for three hours: "Ew, a body part! It's like gay porn!"

But we all loved the movie (I was the only one who had read the graphic novel) and I was impressed by the casting and faithfulness to the source material, although some of the emotional weight of the original was missing, I walked out very satisfied.

Posted by: Rob at March 8, 2009 4:31 AM

...and I'm back. Refreshed enough that I can speak intelligently on the movie without needlessly focussing on blue penis.

Unfortunately, I have to agree with 90% of the people who commented on Ackerman's acting skills. She is...not good. I've seen much worse acting, of course, but in a movie where everyone else brought their A-game, she was sorely out of place.

And the scene on Mars was interesting, but I felt a disparity on the effect of the news Laurie received re: her father and her reaction. I hadn't made the connection regarding how reprehensible the idea of The Comedian was as a father figure. I mean, he was sadistically flawed, but also came the closest to being able to understand human nature.

Finally, Haley stole this film. He was WICKED-GOOD. Is it a bad thing that I thought about him in a naughty way (but *only* if he kept his mask on)? I always do go for the sociopaths...
Also, Night Owl just played the part of a pansy too well, he was quite limp. Heh. I slay myself sometimes.

Posted by: popejenn at March 8, 2009 4:37 AM

Than vs. Then,

I can accept a lot of things, I can accept being called vile, I can accept being called misogynistic, I can even accept being called a xenophobe. But I can not accept you being someone that posts comments here on a regular basis and with a screen name that we all know, but now chooses to post a comment directed at me under a made up screen name to hide your true identity.

If you are going to come here like a thief in the night and attempt to assassinate my character, please extend me the courtesy of knowing your true identity.

On a more personal note, I do not believe in the death penalty, but as barbaric as it is even the condemned are grated a last request. Than vs. Then, I say to you, unmask yourself and allow me to look upon my executioner without deception.

Posted by: Pookie at March 8, 2009 4:53 AM

Pookie, I pinkie swear that I'm not anyone with a screen name you'd recognize because I don't comment often because my time zone is opposite yours. I realize you enjoy the drama, but really, I wasn't condemning you to death or assassinating your character. Just pointing out that after collecting all those comments in order to make a point about grammar, you're wrong. And that was funny to me. Like I said, I had a friend like you in school so I know a little about the mind set. I got many comments like "How can you be friends with that guy?" but really he was just harmless. And, come on, "unmask yourself" in a Watchmen post is pretty funny.

Posted by: Than vs. Then at March 8, 2009 5:11 AM

George, I see what youre saying and I completely understand why they did it this way, but I still have to disagree about it not working in volumes. Kill Bill didn't really have a clear ending of volume one, neither did pirates of the carribbean two or the matrix reloaded, but they were all box office successes as well as inferior stories to watchmen. People would definitely come back, just end it around where roarschach gets arrested and slap a "to be continued" in there to piss people off and you're good! :) doing it the way they did has critics and fans alike saying that Snyder stripped the humanity out of the work which is bad publicity that could prove to be very bad for box office draws and ends up pissing off the hardcore fans which the movie is geared to anyway. Plus, now I'm pissed that I have to wait again to see the movies I really wanted to see in the first place. A lot of my favorite parts are the dramatic side stories that they had to cut from the theatrical release and it just shows how empty the book really is without all of the small touches. This is not a poor reflection if Snyder, it just kind of ruined the experience for me and a lot of others telling from the reviews that are popping up everywhere. I honestly think that most of the complaints people have willbe removed when the extended cuts come out, myself included. Well, except those about the violence and blue junk, which will only get worse.

Posted by: Smatt584 at March 8, 2009 5:40 AM

I saw this movie for free a week ago and I wanted to ask for my money back.

Too fucking long.

The last time I read Watchmen was 6-7 years ago (haven't been able to find a copy since then), I didn't read any spoilers about the movie so I wouldn't be disappointed, so it was pretty confusing.

And I went with people who haven't read it, so they were even more out of the loop.

It's not a movie that would gel well with people who aren't fans of the graphic novel.


I was really surprised that they were allowed to show blue wang. And it's not rated R here in my neck of the woods. Nothing wrong with blue genitals, but I didn't think there would be any in there.

I wonder if Dr. Manhattan has blue jizz.
Or if he ever had an orgy with himself.

"I always thought that Watchmen would be more suited to an adaptation as a television miniseries than a movie. Any thoughts?
Mr. West"

I thought that when I was leaving the cinema, that maybe it would have been suited better to the smaller screen. No story lines cut out, and stretch it out so people don't get numb bums from sitting and watching it.

Posted by: bakers_dozen at March 8, 2009 7:27 AM

Than vs Then: 'Than' never applies to one thing. It's a comparative preposition. One thing has to be more or less 'than' another, and it goes between them to balance the comparison.

'Watchmen features more blue cocks than Iron Man.'
'Malin Ackerman is worse than cancer in this movie.'

'Then' means 'at that time' (adverb) or 'in that case' (modifier).

'If Warners had stumped up for a score instead of those fucking awful song choices, then Watchmen would have been better.'
'If the director's cut doesn't completely lack any sense of tragedy or loss in the last act then I will be happier.'

"If it's happening and someone shows me, than that's one thing" is like saying 'If the sex scene was five minutes shorter, than Snyder could have added some plot structure', which obviously doesn't work. And, in any case, was probably too much to ask for.

In conclusion:'If Rorschach hits that dummy one more time with the meat cleaver, then I might give up on this movie entirely. But it's still better than I expected.'

Posted by: Zuffle at March 8, 2009 7:44 AM

I'm still not understanding the length-bitching. Besides, a "digestible" version of this story would be cut to ribbons by people here.

Posted by: Jay at March 8, 2009 9:35 AM

So...

Why couldn't this have been a 6 hour long movie?

Or...had they done this, big budget like the first battlestar galactic mini series...

Sure, ok not in the theater...but Watchmen could be done in Twelve 40 minute episodes. Or two 2.5 hour Kill Bill type.

That would've been something new.
Hell, it would've been great instead of saying 3 hours 30 minutes directors cut they said 5 hour directors cut! - Or maybe that's the have to buy it again 12 months later...

They remade batman and superman, hulk etc and one day they'll re-do LXG and Daredevil...catwoman even...

So one day maybe they'll re-do Watchmen too.

All in all I will be seeing this as it has to better than many many other movies and so far the reviews are at least it's worth seeing in the theater. Roger Ebert says see it and see it again.


Watch the motion comic it's decent.

Posted by: WhoWhatWhere at March 8, 2009 10:11 AM

Carlson's spot on, kids.

The only thing I don't get is why Snyder feels the need to put a naked woman floating in zero-gravity in his movies. Humping in Archie, the seer in 300. If he could've got away with it, he would've had zero-g zombies floating in invisible water. Did Snyder lose his virginity to a shampoo commercial?

And Pookiemon, dude. Were you saving those I Love Beets comments on a spreadsheet or something to get your final slam in? That's like some nerd who writes a scathing comeuppance of the jocks who've swirlied him in the school newspaper. Seriously, just because you deliver the pizzas doesn't mean it counts as getting out of the house.

Posted by: hatemail at March 8, 2009 1:05 PM

If he could've got away with it, he would've had zero-g zombies floating in invisible water.

I infer that you view this as a negative hatemail. I am sorry to hear about your retardation. I assume it was just recently that you lost the majority of your reasoning and cognitive abilities as, everyone knows, the addition of zombies automatically adds 200 superstars. Ease up Corky.

Posted by: admin at March 8, 2009 1:32 PM

Yeah, admin, it's true. I'm suffering from retardation. My will to read is sapping. Paul Blart: Zoo Cop sounds like an awesome idea. Suddenly, losing my desire to succeed at life. Feel the need to move to Canada.

Nah, even I'm not retarded enough to call ham bacon.

Posted by: hatemail at March 8, 2009 1:51 PM

Oh no you di'n't...

I sense a Canadia v. United States smackdown comin' on! WHOO! Sunday boredom... CURED!

(Wait, does hatemail know admin is from Canadia? ...you know what, it doesn't even matter. SMACKDOWN!)

Posted by: Anna von Beaverplatz at March 8, 2009 2:27 PM

Once again hatemail your arrogance is surpassed only by your ignorance. Throughout the weekend I Love Beets has attacked me for no other reason than to provoke me, it is people like I Love Beets that will ultimately drive me away from pajiba. I come here to be among friends and share our love of cinema. I Love Beets is a hack of the highest caliber, he/she has diarrhea of the mouth.

Posted by: Pookie at March 8, 2009 2:52 PM

I had never heard of the Watchmen before and had no interest in them. The only reason I went to see this movie was because of the glowing blue lower Manhattan. And it was well worth it to learn size doesn't matter, it's how many times you can multiply it that counts.

Posted by: The Land Snark at March 8, 2009 2:56 PM

Sometimes the biggest bullies have the thinnest skin.

Any explanation for this?

Posted by: Recondite at March 8, 2009 3:06 PM

I quit, I don't need the hassle anymore. You goddamn people have tried to twist my words for the last time. It is over for me. I'm out, you can have pajiba to yourselves.

Posted by: Pookie at March 8, 2009 3:09 PM

See ya in an hour then.

The motion comic comes with this sorta check to give the theater for 7.50's worth of a ticket, so I saw it again for fifty cents just now. I noticed that the psychiatrist's briefcase combination is set on 300. Har har. I was pretty pleased to hear "First, We Take Manhattan" after "Desolation Row". It's still a little ironic that there's space to fill because of a 3-minute version of a 9-minute song, but I liked the extra gag, even if I prefer R.E.M's version (but I don't prefer Leonard Cohen's originals in general anyway).

Posted by: Jay at March 8, 2009 3:19 PM

Hard to believe none of you have kids...

It's being marketed to kids... DURING KIDS' PROGRAMMING. And how do I know this? Because I have a KID. Who watches... KIDS' PROGRAMMING. And yes, they ARE advertising it during said programming.

SHOCKER, huh?

They also, I hear, market CIGARETTES to children.

GASP.

And to any idiots who didn't bother to fully read my comment before they started typing a response: I did NOT, in fact, COMPLAIN about this. I merely remarked that it is, in fact, happening. And that my husband and I did NOT, in fact, take our 9 year old son to see it but DID, in fact, see it with the intention of sussing whether he COULD see it. There are MANY movies with "R" ratings that I am fine with my 9 year old seeing. This, however, is not among them.

But how ANYONE reading my previous comment could infer that I was WHINING about any of this is simply beyond me... unless, of course, they didn't actually READ the entire comment.

I'm NOT complaining about it -- it's the way of the world, c'est la friggin' vie, yadda yadda yadda.

But sit down in front of the Cartoon Network for a day and tell me they're not marketing this to kids, and I'll call you a fucking liar. Because they fucking well are.

Posted by: Maryscott O'Connor at March 8, 2009 3:20 PM

I went in thinking that nothing mattered other than getting Rorschach right - and Jackie Earle Haley simply ruled this movie, so I'm happy. I can basically take or leave everything else, though I do enjoy both the novel and the movie overall.

The only real disappointment was when Patrick Wilson's actressin' ruined Haley's astounding last moments on screen.

Posted by: S.K. at March 8, 2009 3:32 PM

Jesus Christ died for this? Holy shit Mary Scott and Spongie, are you stroke-circuiting? Have some balls as a parent. Have some balls as a parent and tell your little shitbags "NO!" Spongie, enough. Enough of the people in the room know who you are now and that is very special. Scheizematrons, the two of you!

About Jackie Earl Haley, he was better than I imagined he would be. Going in, I was remembering him as "Dukes," the dirty hippie from that Ferrell ABA fluke. The first time we saw him with the mask off and the camera nor narration do anything to let us in on it; all my doubts went away.
"I'm a miracle!"

Yeah, the music was thick slab. "It's all a joke," gets said too many times. Bubastis too small. Moloch not enough like a shaved John Bolton. All paltry non-issues. It was Not too long. I could have sat for more. Book is still better, but the movie is damn good.

Posted by: Jackseppelin at March 8, 2009 4:16 PM

Spoongie,
Reading in your first post "'Cause you know, it's the struggle between capitalism and communism that was the only source of conflict in the entire world" coupled with your comments that it was awful and lame led me to misinterpret and think that you really believed that was what the movie was about. Historically, the struggle between the two was the major source of conflict post WWII (i.e, Vietnam, Korea, Cold War, Bay of Pigs, Cuban Missile Crisis, McCarthyism, etc.) but that wasn't the point of the movie, it was the backdrop for a different sort of exploration. As you went on to explain your reasoning I better understand your viewpoint and concur with some points you make. For instance, "What I thought was cheap and sloppy was how the superheroes seem to accept Nixon's televised address as evidence that now peace truly will reign." What! You don't think a super-intelligent "superhero" should trust old Tricky Dick? Although, as Vermillion pointed out, everlasting peace wasn't the goal of Ozymandias' plan.

I still don't agree that is was a terrible movie.

Posted by: Sharopa at March 8, 2009 4:26 PM

Jackseppelin,

I'm going to bat for both Spoongie and MaryScott. You obviously did not engage your brain when typing. MaryScott DID NOT take her child to the movie. And calling her children "shitbags" isn't nearly as funny as your immature, school-yard mind seems to think. Spoongie is entitled to his opinions and at least he/she wrote coherently. Both of them make valid points, in English, in full sentences, unlike yourself. I really doubt you "could have sat for more" without your caretaker providing additional medication.

Posted by: Sharopa at March 8, 2009 4:45 PM

My review:

http://whaven33884.blogspot.com/2009/03/movie-dungeon-time.html

And the sightings of Giant Blue Whamadoodle were not egregious or blatant. Dr. Manhattan's full frontal nude scenes were perfectly valid (be fair, if YOU had godlike powers you'd traipse around nekkid too).

Posted by: The Wanderer at March 8, 2009 4:50 PM

Nah, even I'm not retarded enough to call ham bacon.

No, your retarded enough to call your sister Mom.

There is a distinct difference between Canadian bacon and ham. One more insult like that and we're gonna have to throw down.

Posted by: admin at March 8, 2009 4:51 PM

Sharopa, you are a scholar and a gentleman (in as gender-neutral a sense as possible) :-)

Posted by: Spongie at March 9, 2009 5:45 AM

Anybody else think maskless Rorschach looked like Danny Bonaduce fucked Martin Short?

Oh, my, God, YES. YES, a thousand times. I didn't realize it before but you said it just now and it's like someone threw open a curtain and light is flooding into my brain.

Anyway, c'mon people. I'm an immature bitch; I snicker at blue dicks on screen.YOU ARE ALL SUPPOSED TO BE BETTER THAN ME. So act like it.

Posted by: monkey_b at March 9, 2009 6:46 AM

I'm definitely not the target audience. I've not read the novel. Maybe those two things made it easier for me to just go with it - overall I really enjoyed the show. Much kudos to Jackie Earle Haley; many times when a hero takes off his mask, one is disappointed. In the case of Rorschach, he was just as compelling demasked. I can't complain over Wilson or Akerman either, as I bought into them for the most part. Are they Academy Award actors? No. But they made me feel something, and for this genre, that's an accomplishment.
I did find both the character (Ozy) and Matthew Goode a bit laughable. But I didn't mind the big, blue penis (when it wasn't trying to do its intended job, that is). I was fine with it just hanging around as a natural part of the scenery.
I also have to give props for Morgan for doing so much with his sporadic scenes - I was riveted whenever he was onscreen.

Posted by: Cindy at March 9, 2009 8:17 AM

I can't believe how funny it is to hear people constantly talking about Dr. Manhattan's nudity; I mean, he has a face, look at that instead, heh. I'll say that I didn't read the graphic novel first, I just read the "Watchmen 101" and I have to say that I totally loved the film. Of course, I'm biased as a Political Science/History major and found the subtle plot points that were included like the Minutemen Montage a great way to explain the costumed hero concept. I can say wholeheartedly that some people just won't get it, others will understand the various levels of plots and still others will claim that it was not good enough. That's great because regardless of what everyone says, this movie just went up on my top 100 regardless. I loved the dour feel, the confused superheroes and the special effects and even if it is 161 minutes I know the following: I got my $10 worth of stunning movie and I am satisfied and I plan to see it in IMAX for kicks.

Posted by: Phil Slama at March 9, 2009 8:54 AM

http://www.diaryoffools.com/2009/03/dof-champions-of-society-debbie.html

I wrote a little diddy on our superhero Debbie Schlussel. If this is seen as spam please delete my post and accept my apology. Just wanted to share my thoughts on this kind of polarized and dangerous thinking she employs.

Great site, great review. Thanks again guys.

Posted by: tajmccall at March 9, 2009 9:08 AM

Did anyone else notice that all the men wore masks but none of the women did (except for dr. manhattan)

Posted by: jasper at March 9, 2009 10:43 AM

Ok, I'll admit I haven't read all of the other comments....but, as someone not really familiar with the comic, I was both impressed by the visuals (oooh, pretty!!! O MY GOD!!!! A GIANT BLUE PENIS!!!!) and disappointed in the story line that never really made me care about any character other than Rorschach. Jackie Earle Haley was phenomenal.

Lots of pretty colors, copious amounts of blood, violence and fairly graphic sex (some mouth-breather in the showing we were at brought a fairly young child....I began to wonder if they questioned that decision when several Dr. Manhattan's were getting it on with Silk Spectre II, then again when bones broke thru the skin in several fight scenes)

As for the casting, Billy Crudup has such a great voice, and it was used to pretty good effect. His small actual screen time was good. Malin Ackerman? JEZUS!!!!! Dress up a Barbie doll in shiny spandex and she could have played that part. Patrick Wilson? Ummm, dude, change your inflection once in a while, will ya? Same with Matthew Goode...pretty, pretty boy with nothing going on inside. Jeffrey Dean Morgan & Jackie Earle Haley were great, though, and the opening credit sequence? Brilliant. That was my favorite part of the movie.

Overall, an 85. Lots of flash and a fairly good beat, but hard to dance to it.....

Posted by: dammitjanet at March 9, 2009 11:35 AM

I have to throw in with those who said the music was bad. Not just bad, hilariously asinine. Absoultely no subtlety or originality--or have those particular songs now gone past the cliched jokes they had been and into the pantheon of cultural shorthand?

Because I do not accept Tears for Fears as being part of my cultural pantheon, thanks.

I was desensitized to the blue dong pretty early on. It's not like it was a raging boner or he ran around smacking people with it.

Again, I'm throwing in with those who say finally, we are getting some penis to balance out all of the boobs.

But was I the only one bothered by how lame the female characters were? None of them could stand to live without a guy to validate her existance, apparantly, except the (unnamed?) lesbian (who got killed off way too early, in my opinion.)

Posted by: frumpiefox at March 9, 2009 11:35 AM

I think I might be missing something since I am not familiar with the comic book but Dr. Manhattan (blue penis aside) was the most pretentious and idiotic asshole around. He was such a snore to watch...I could barely stand any of his soapbox speeches. Ugh...he was insufferable.

Posted by: Wanda at March 9, 2009 12:44 PM

who got killed off way too early, in my opinion

It's footnote history in the book, really, she says one line in a flashback scene and you don't see that stuff happen, so the credit montage actually gives you more than the book did and is not diminishing the character.

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 1:26 PM

Ugh...he was insufferable.

That's the point. Notice how his girlfriends felt the same way?

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 1:27 PM

Jay--that figures. I haven't gotten very far into the book yet, so I wasn't sure if she showed up more or not. Too bad, really.

"Notice how his girlfriends felt the same way?" Yet, they still wanted to be with him....

Sorry, I'll get off MY soapbox now.

Posted by: frumpiefox at March 9, 2009 2:25 PM

"Notice how his girlfriends felt the same way?" Yet, they still wanted to be with him....

Helllloooooo? Blue wang? Multiple blue wang, at one point?

Posted by: Vermillion at March 9, 2009 2:55 PM

Smokey Robinson wrote a song about it. People are damn fools like that all the time.

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 2:55 PM

But that idiot Laurie TURNED DOWN the multiple blue wang! Dude, if my bf could replicate himself like that and get it on while playing WOW, I'd be thrilled! (I'd also probably never get a damn thing done, so "yay, WOW," I guess.)

Just proves my point, the women were lame.

Posted by: frumpiefox at March 9, 2009 4:37 PM

Hey, me and George Michael like our sex natural, fun and one-on-one. Maybe Ms. Juspeczyk does too, ya freak!

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 4:45 PM

New Order made a video about it. People have group sex with blue guys all the time.

Posted by: frumpiefox at March 9, 2009 5:11 PM

You keep your Europerversion outta here!

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 5:48 PM

Jay - I know he was supposed to be. But I just don't want to hear him complain about loosing touch with humanity. A "guy" without humanity cannot be sad about not having humanity...it just doesn't work that way.

Like his girlfriend...I would have much preferred the chubby superhero.

Posted by: Wanda at March 9, 2009 6:05 PM

Well, I've long thought I probably wouldn't come into my own til the mid-30s or so myself. Jay and Dan--the ones who are still around after you're done with that guy.

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 6:42 PM

Thanks, Sharopa. The dimwit to whom you were responding obviously did NOT take the time to read my comments in their ENTIRETY; that, or he's not one to let the facts get in the way of (what he obviously THINKS is) a good smackdown.

Once again: I didn't take my kid to the film, nor will I. That's THREE times I've said it.

And anyone who DOES take a small child (mine is 9 years old and he still qualifies as "small child" when it comes to a movie like this) to this flick is either braindead, an asshole or both.

One last note: to those supercilious twerps who keep emphasising the "R" rating and how that's "proof" that they're not marketing this to kids -- Where the fuck were you raised, Chuckles, Mayberry USA? That's like saying they don't market BOOZE to kids because of the drinking age and warning labels.

Idiocy. Sheer naive idiocy. Am I the only one who remembers Joe Camel?

Posted by: Maryscott O'Connor at March 9, 2009 7:43 PM

I never bought the Joe Camel hullabaloo myself. Sure, I bought that his snout looked phallic, as many opined, but not that it was made to be attractive to 10 year olds. There was nothing attractive about that anthropomorphized hairy bastard.

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 8:19 PM

frumpiefox I am CRYING from laughing at your WOW comment.

BRING ON THE MULTIPLE BLUE WANGS!!!!

Posted by: dammitjanet at March 9, 2009 8:46 PM

Finally saw the movie. Not great but it had it's moments. Ozymandias suggesting new villains for his toy line within earshot of Oil suits was funny as hell.

Warhol painting Nite Owl II came off as glib but fun.

But having Ozymandias commit his crime simply for energy concerns. Come onnnn.

Posted by: Mr. West at March 9, 2009 10:35 PM

But having Ozymandias commit his crime simply for energy concerns. Come onnnn.

Except he didn't.

Posted by: Jay at March 9, 2009 10:50 PM

I didn't go to see this with any expectations (never read the source material) beyond being worth my time and money.
And god, it really was not. Plot points all over the place, action sequences that seemed random . . . this movie sucked. A lot. It's a terrible movie that thinks it's a great movie. I was hoping halfway through that it would be so bad it was funny, but that just didn't happen either. Poor, stupid movie. I feel kind of bad for it. The way I feel bad for adults who wet the bed.

Posted by: Sharon at March 10, 2009 12:31 AM

For all the hype-
meh. Thoroughly unimpressed.

Rorshach and the Comedian were bad as hell, though.

Posted by: krza at March 10, 2009 12:48 AM

Thank you Jay for correcting my mistake. But still that does not take away from the fact that Veidt commits his crime not out of vanity (as in the comic books) but solely out of a supposed moral superiority. Out of all the characters adapted i think that Ozymandias was the poorest translation. In the books he is the nicest guy on earth so when I find out what happens in the end tis a shock. But in the movie Ozymandias is written as a tree hugging stiff. So when the hammer falls it's not much a surprise. More Alexander of Macedonia than Rameses II. In the books Ozymandias starts out wanting to conquer the world but towards the end he wants to "save' it. The film got one half of that equation right but not the other half.

All in all the visuals were spot on til the end at Karnak, then everything went to shit. Overall it felt like the things were inert.

Posted by: Mr.West at March 10, 2009 4:37 AM

Love this movie so much.Here is a movie community mixedmate.c0m. You can share your ideas with others if you want.

Posted by: evan at March 10, 2009 4:46 AM

SPOILERS: Personally, I could live with almost every change in the movie, no secondary characters, no backstory about Veidt's ulterior motives for his actions, no retribution for Nite Owl II's adventures. But what i could not stand was the denouement at Karnak. From the fight gaudy scenes to Nite Owl saying " NOOOO!" From having Doc tell laurie goodbye instead of Veidt to having Laurie utter Osterman's last line. It rang false big time. But what rankles me most is that the bomb coming from within (Osterman) than without (fabricated alien).

Posted by: Mr. West at March 10, 2009 4:55 AM

Anybody else having probs with comments running off to the side? I can't read the whole sentence, dammit!!

Posted by: dammitjanet at March 10, 2009 8:43 AM

I'm with Optimus and others--the soundtrack was completely ridiculous and distracting. Whoever was in charge of that came off like a novice.

Also, it irks me that they spent a ridiculous amount of time on a super-cheesy sex scene when the movie is nearly three hours long.

Posted by: Hannah at March 10, 2009 1:52 PM

I know I am wayyyyy late to this party, but I only saw the movie yesterday, and I have to say I really liked it. Mainly because Snyder and writers kept the intention and spirit of the graphic novel, despite having made all those plot changes. I have always seen this graphic novel as meditations on heroism. Well, comic book heroism, that is. The following questions are raised: what does a guy who doesn't believe in compromise, but maims and destroys to get to "good" (Rorshach), what kind of heroism is that? What about the smartest guy? What kind of solutions does he think up? What about people who just like the adventure of it - Night Owl and Silk Spectre II? What about the mother protecting her child - she's a hero in the best sense of the word for that, and extremely flawed in her choices. And then there's the guy who is so powerful he is on a cosmic level - what does being a hero really mean to him, a man able to see so far beyond the immediate that it is difficult to figure out what's really important?

That's the kind of thing that I thought Moore was trying to get at with The Watchmen character. There is a lot of social commentary, Moore likes to cover a lot of things all at once. But they couldn't put all of that in, and if all they really could do was look at the heroes, I think they did a pretty good job with it. I really loved reading The Watchmen the first time, because it was so subversive to the cliched view of comic book heroes with cookie cutter morality - heroes good, villains bad. I liked that these were the choices they went with in the script - they made the movie I wanted to see. WIN!

And I'd rather watch blue peen on the screen than Spiderman tap dance. Just sayin'. This movie wasn't perfect, but at least it didn't disrepect the characters like they did Spidey.

Posted by: Chickaboom at March 10, 2009 1:57 PM

Well, again, I'm going for a third time this week, so the haters can continue to go left.

Posted by: Jay at March 10, 2009 2:11 PM

Big fan of the book.
Thoroughly disappointed with the movie.
Same thoughts as most of the other clear thinkers here....too long, too little imagination, too bad. During the movie, I felt like I would have been better served if I had stayed home, took a long shit and re-read the comic book.
The movie ADDED nothing.

Posted by: mothyham at March 11, 2009 3:52 PM

Clear thinkers. I LOVE

Posted by: Jay at March 11, 2009 4:21 PM

condescension.


Damn, the one-stage comment got me. Fool me once...!

Posted by: Jay at March 11, 2009 4:22 PM

does anyone realize that the soundtrack used was almost entirely taken from (and certainly done in the spirit of) the direct reference to those specific songs in the graphic novel? alan moore intended for the reader to 'hear' each of those songs during the scenes in the book. yeah. just to clarify.

Posted by: jasper at March 13, 2009 2:14 PM

I've seen it 5 times now... and I think a lot of people are missing out with their shallow expectations of the film. It's a deeply woven tapestry of visual information that simply cannot be absorbed by even the most diehard fan the first few viewings.

This isn't the book, and that's a good thing. It's a pretty damn good summary of the book though, and it'll definitely encourage people who never considered picking up a graphic novel to do so.

Much like Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, long time fans have to understand that it isn't a damn competition. One doesn't have to be better than the other. They're completely different mediums, and expecting things that work in comics to work on the screen is pretty silly, and vice versa.

The music is spot on... and I'm surprised so many forget that Moore choose the majority of the songs IN THE BOOK. (Similarly, people seem to forget there was also a lot of blue penis involved in the book as well. Why should they change that just because America is prude?)

This movie gets more right than wrong, and definitely improves with repeat viewing. I humbly suggest the haters grow up a bit and give it another try, this time without the 20 year old chip on their shoulder because they read the book when it first came out.

Peace y'all. And remember, if some poor schlub walks out of the theater looking confused... tell him to pick up the book. That's how our man Alan gets his bread and butter.

(Also, pick up the new Swamp Thing TPB... some of Moore's best writing)

Posted by: Akiman at March 13, 2009 2:50 PM

i don't understand how anyone could have a problem with this movie except to say that it wasn't exactly what they personally expected; the movie was pretty much flawless

Posted by: coffee at March 15, 2009 1:32 PM

Someone farther up in the thread asked if they went to see this a week or two out, would they have their pick of seats?

Yes you will. Saw it 3/15 and could have sat anywhere in the theater.


Posted by: mswas at March 16, 2009 1:17 PM

Having thankfully not reread the watchmen comic since its publication, I went to see the movie with little memories of the plot.
Found it very good even though the plot and the characters aren't as detailed as what I remember from the original graphic novel (yes, even Malin Akerman does a nice job of, er, bimbo impersonation. Plus definitely looking hot in latex).

Posted by: tanas at March 23, 2009 1:55 AM

good lord. am i really reading this right? we really live in a world of people that are impossible to please. i mean did we all watch the same movie? it was a beautiful savage opera, strained through an acid trip, it's almost impossible to put into words the level that this has breathed life into the printed word and inked line, a cinematic milestone of awesomeness. sure it strayed ever so slightly from the source material, but not meeting the bar set by one of the greatest works ever made (and only by a leeeeeettle bit) does not mean it's a failure.

In a world of comic book movies where the best we can often hope for is mediocre, when something like batman begins and spiderman 2 are the rocks around which rage a torrent of suck, in a world where we have comic movies like catwoman and punisher warzone, ghost rider and rise of the silver surfer, where a GOOD comic movie is almost beyond hope, snyder hands you a GREAT one and all anyone can do is bitch about the big blue cock?!?

wake the fuck up people and forget the damn blue penis. and i hate to tell you, but the damn thing was hardly noticable, so what we got here is a lot of people paying an innordinate amount of attention to a cgi blue cock.

christ, go watch judge dredd or something ya damn nay-sayers

Posted by: zack at March 25, 2009 4:37 AM

let me amend that, not all of you, just the dinks. like for example, no beef with akiman, that guy uses his noodle. everything i forgot to say, he said, see above

Posted by: zack at March 25, 2009 4:39 AM